Zak Foster
Photos
Title
Zak Foster
Identifier
NY11226-001
Format
audio
Video
Interviewee
Zak Foster
Interviewer
Emma Parker
Interview Date
10/30/2020
Interview sponsor
Martha Sielman
Transcriber
Emma Parker
OHMS Object
OHMS Object Text
5.4 Interview with Zak Foster NY11203-001 Quilters' S.O.S. -- Save Our Stories The New York QSOS Quilt Alliance Zak Foster Emma Parker 2:|3(319)|15(68)|23(153)|25(3)|31(231)|35(55)|57(88)|57(417)|69(230)|93(37)|107(23)|123(36)|127(60)|129(60)|129(402)|133(272)|145(58)|145(375)|153(194)|159(95)|171(57)|173(268) 0 https://quiltalliance.net/qsos-audio/Zak Foster QSOS.mp3 Other audio 6 Learning to quilt and early quiltmaking experiences Tell me about your interest in quiltmaking and how you got started making quilts. Zak talks about his early experiences watching his grandmother sewing garments, and sewing a four-patch block at school. childhood ; Learning quiltmaking 356 Quilts of Gees Bend and the work of Irene Williams They obviously continue have--and for folks that are familiar with my work--continue to have an influence on my work and on my approach. Zak talks about seeing quilts made by women in Gee's Bend, Alabama and how they have influenced his work. He also discusses how to honor and respect that work as a white male quiltmaker. African American quiltmakers ; Appropriation ; Gee's Bend quilts ; Male quiltmakers African American quilts -- Alabama -- Gee's Bend ; Boykin (Wilcox County, Ala.) https://www.soulsgrowndeep.org/artist/irene-williams/work/strips " ; Strips" ; by Irene Williams, a Gee's Bend quilter, made of basketball jerseys https://www.soulsgrowndeep.org/artist/irene-williams/work/blocks " ; Blocks" ; by Irene Williams, made with orange poncho 516 Making quilts using repurposed and found materials How would you describe the quilts you make now? Zak describes how many of his quilts are inspired by the fabrics he finds and repurposes. He talks about making memorial quilts and the ways in which clothing can tell a story about its owners. Quilt Purpose - Memorial ; Repurposed fabrics 676 Improvisation and sensitivity in the quiltmaking process And it's important to me to remain open and sensitive... Zak talks about how quiltmaking has taught him that sensitivity can be an asset, and being open to possibilities while making quilts without a set pattern. Design process ; Improvisational piecing Improvisation in art ; Truitt, Anne, 1921-2004 773 About the touchstone quilt and " ; oracle quilting" ; I'm skipping ahead slightly: we typically ask folks to bring a touchstone quilt or sometimes it's more than one. Do you want to share one quilt? Do you feel like you is a touchstone for your says something about your your work? Zak shares a quilt he made in 2017--the first full-size quilt made after the election of United States President Donald Trump. It was an improvisational quilt that came to represent ideas about a brighter future. 981 Quiltmaking in difficult times and the " ; O, America!" ; quilt Have you used quiltmaking in the past to get through other difficult times? After reading an essay about reclaiming the American flag, Zak pieced his own American flag, and incorporated it into a quilt made from blocks responding to news items from the first 100 days of the Trump presidency. America ; American flag ; Political quilts ; Protest quilts Kingsolver, Barbara https://www.sfgate.com/opinion/openforum/article/And-our-flag-was-still-there-2876076.php " ; And Our Flag Was Still There" ; by Barbara Kingsolver, which helped inspire the " ; O, America!" ; quilt http://www.zakfoster.com/2019/1/19/yw7emeq895qvldkd4rfbw2o4t35fdz Detail photograph of quilt 1184 Zak's studio ; quiltmaking and teaching Can you describe the place where you make, or your studio? Zak's quilts are made in his walk-in kitchen. He describes his workspace and talks about how he makes time to quilt while also working full-time as a high school teacher. He also considers how his life as a teacher and a quiltmaker intersect. Design Wall ; Teaching ; Work or Studio space 1511 Collaborative work and community Do you... I'm curious if you feel like you work in a in a community of quilters? Zak talks about community and his relationship with social media. He talks about his interest in collaborative work, and the " ; 43 for 43" ; project, in which Zak coordinated a number of quiltmakers to create quilt blocks to honor 43 students from a rural teaching college in Mexico who disappeared in 2014. collaboration ; Social media ; Social quiltmaking activities Escuela Normal Rural de Ayotzinapa -- Students https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Iguala_mass_kidnapping About the 2014 kidnapping http://www.zakfoster.com/blog/2016/3/5/43-for-43 Blog post and video about the 43 for 43 project 1813 Quilts as vessels for political or community messages You mentioned... I mean many of your quilts have have messages. Is there... Why do you think that quilts are uniquely suited or rather, do you think that quilts are uniquely suited, for carrying a message? Zak talks about why quilts, as domestic objects, are well-suited to carry political or social messages. He talks about the work of artist Kathryn Clark and her foreclosure quilts, and the Latin American tradition of the cacerolazo ; a noise-making protest often with pots, pans, and other household items. political quilts ; social justice http://www.kathrynclark.com/foreclosure-quilts.html Kathryn Clark's Foreclosure Quilts 2020 Inspiration from quiltmakers, artists and writers Is there other folks or other sort of moments or anything--it doesn't have to be quilting related--that you're you're really drawn to or have been inspiring you lately? Zak talks about other quiltmakers he admires, as well as how he is inspired by the writings of Ralph Waldo Emerson, Henry David Thoreau, Barbara Kingsolver and Mary Oliver. Emerson, Ralph Waldo, 1803-1882 ; Kingsolver, Barbara ; Thoreau, Henry David, 1817-1862 http://www.phys.unm.edu/~tw/fas/yits/archive/oliver_wildgeese.html " ; Wild Geese" ; by Mary Oliver https://www.heidiparkes.com/ Heidi Parkes website https://artoftijay.com/ Tijay Mohammed website 2203 Qualities of a great quilt and the lifespan of quilts I love to ask it, but it's really a challenge. What do you think makes a great quilt? Zak describes his ideas about a great quilt--a quilt made with and attention--and what makes a great quilt as art. He talks about where his quilts end up, and the storage of his quilts in his bedroom. He also talks about his long-arm machine and how the quilting process is his least favorite part of quilting. Aesthetics ; everyday use ; Long arm quilting machine What makes a great quilt? http://www.annetruitt.org/ Anne Truitt's wood sculptures 2516 The importance of quilts in American Life EP:What do you think that is the importance of quilts in American life? Do they... That's, that's a that's a loaded question, but if you want to talk a little bit about that. ZF: I do love, and it kind of circles back to a few moments ago. But I do love that quilting is not usually something that's done in a studio, is not done in a separate space. Usually it's done in people's homes, it is the heart. Zak talks about quilts as intimate objects meant for the bed, which is the heart of the home. He shares his ideas of commonly held American values and the capacity for quilting projects meant to bring America together. american quilting ; american values Oral History EP: So let' ; s just jump right in with this very first question: tell me about your interest in quiltmaking and how you got started making quilts. ZF: Yeah, you know, I think for a long time I was an artist in search of quilting. You know, I grew up in North Carolina. And North Carolina, as you know, has a long tradition of producing textiles, right? Right up into the eighties and kind of mid-eighties, it kind of petered out. So I grew up surrounded in this landscape of textiles, but I didn' ; t really have a personal connection. I know that my mom had a sewing machine when I grew up, but I didn' ; t really see it being used that much. My first sewing memory was with her mom, who is now a hundred and four years old, still kickin' ; and wonderful. And I remember going to her house once and seeing that she was making a dress and being so fascinated. I was probably like five years old or so, being so fascinated with pattern paper, clothing pattern, paper like that, this brown, thin... Just so fragile. And I' ; m like, oh, sewing is so mysterious, you know, like how do we take these raw materials and make something? But then I didn' ; t do anything with fabric. Hmmm... for about twenty, twenty five years. I do a lot of drawing. I tried painting, screen printing, lithographs, I mean all kinds of stuff. Right? And it seemed like I kind of bounced from one to the other for the longest while. And then one day, about six or seven years ago now, my friends started having their first kids, you know? And so I was like, " ; OK, this is a time for me to try to make a quilt again" ; . I had made one in college. It didn' ; t line up all perfect and square so I thought was a total failure. And I just tossed it the side, and we come back to that quilt in a little bit if you want. But I didn' ; t quilt between college and five or seven years ago. I didn' ; t quilt for nearly a decade and I picked it back up with baby quilts and I' ; ve been hooked ever since, so that' ; s, kind of... I didn' ; t learn from anybody, my family, really, I... Well, that' ; s not true, so I did learn a lot on YouTube. But my partner' ; s mamaw in eastern Tennessee was a big time quilter. And so I learned the basics online. But every holiday when we' ; d come home for Thanksgiving, especially, we would sit and talk about like, oh, how do you do your binding? She does that East Appalachian kind of thing where you, like, roll the back up over the top. EP: Oh, yeah. ZF: And those little details I remember one time coming home from Thanksgiving Day, part of our family tradition is going to the movies after the big meal. Mamaw never did. She stayed home to clean the kitchen. Like, I don' ; t know how you get to cook the meal and get stuck in the kitchen... EP: Yeah, that' ; s a raw deal. ZF: But Mamaw, I guess she was fine with it. She got to see her grandbabies. But I came back from the movies that night and she was sitting at the kitchen table with this quilt of mine that I brought to work on and she was just sewing that binding, and I treasure that quilt because I can look at those stitches and know those aren' ; t those aren' ; t my stitches. Bless her heart, her eyes at that time weren' ; t the best, but it' ; s like it' ; s her signature there in the quilt. I just, I treasure it' ; s a beautiful thing. EP: Helping with binding really is... That' ; s an that' ; s an act of love for sure. Always my least favorite part. But so... before you started quilting, did you have sort of a notion or idea about quilts and who made quilts? I mean, did you, did that, do you have any preconceived ideas about that or was it just something that was, you did once, you thought " ; meh" ; or it was a continually evolving idea? ZF: I think, OK, so if if I' ; m being honest, the very first quilt I ever made was a four square patch made in the third grade because we had, like Laura Ingalls Wilder day at school. We just read Little House on the Prairie. I' ; m like, oh, we' ; re going to these activities. So Zach made him a little four square patch that turned into a pillow. And that was cute. But I think I didn' ; t go any further, my third grade self, because in my mind, quilts were often like, poofy. I' ; m not that, well, I don' ; t say nothing about polyester fill, but it was not the best for the planet. But if you like your quilts poofy, that' ; s fine. But that was the image I had in my mind. And so it took a long time for me to realize, oh, there' ; s other things you can fill quilts with. EP: Sure. ZF: I also thought quilts had to be patterned, right? But now we have seen in the last many, many years that there' ; s many different ways to be a quilt. And I' ; m thankful for that. EP: Yeah, that' ; s that is so true. There are so many ways to be a quilt. And you mentioned you learned a little bit with with Memaw, and a little bit on YouTube. How how did you really come to start making quilts, and what were you looking at in those early days to get a sense of the process? ZF: In the early days, I was just trying to find patterns that I liked, you know, I would basically just like replicate some tried and true Monkey Wrench or something, you know, Pinwheel. My very first quilt I saw to fruition all the way through from patching to binding was a Pinwheel quilt. But some things have held in common from that first baby quilt because I sourced a lot of that fabric from remnants and salvage and things like that. Using repurposed materials is still... ninety-nine percent of what I use when I work now, but in the beginning I was like, " ; let me play by the rules" ; . I wanted to learn the rules. And learn the techniques. And I just I made really pretty precise all-my-corners-met kind of quilt. And then it didn' ; t take too long before I discovered the quilts of Gee' ; s Bend. And they obviously continue to have... For folks that are already familiar with my work, continue to have an influence on on my work and on my approach. And a question I have in my mind that remains unresolved--and if anybody out there has thought so, I' ; m on a search to figure this out--but, you know, there is there is the issue, in my mind at least, about appropriating quilts that have come out of that part of Alabama. And it' ; s weird for me as a white male in this field to be saying, like, " ; oh, I love these. These quilts are beautiful" ; . And how do we, how do I, pay homage and respect to that tradition and the latitude that those women (and one man, as far as I know) opened up with their design approaches, how do I pay respect and homage to that without appropriating it? That' ; s one thing that I think of quite a bit. But when I saw those quilts from Gee' ; s Bend, I was like: here we go. There' ; s some breathing room in this art form. And I think especially if I had to put my finger on one quilter specifically is Irene Williams, she' ; s my spiritual quilting grandmother, I would like to think, if she' ; d have me. She worked a lot in solitude. She worked a lot by herself, not as communal as some of the other ladies. And she was just like, " ; I' ; m going to do what I want to do" ; . Like she' ; s... One of my favorite quilts of hers are two basketball jerseys that she cut up the side seams, right? There' ; s another one there where she took a bright orange poncho and just, like, sewed the hood down flat. She even, like, try to, like, cut the fabric out. She just told the hood down. I love the, the space that she had around her work to create and so... So when I saw her work, I' ; m like, " ; yeah, there' ; s something fun we can do here with this" ; . And so I' ; ve been kind of searching ever since. Like what? What else can we do with this art form? EP: Sure. That' ; s a that' ; s a great question and a great journey. And I think a lot of people, maybe struggle a little bit with that notion of Gee' ; s Bend and appropriation? And I think in the early days, particularly of the Modern Quilt movement, there was a lot of.. a little bit of wrestling with that, maybe acknowledged or unacknowledged, so I' ; m really interested to hear you talk about that. So your early quilts were really precise. How would you describe your work now? I mean, are you... You mentioned you' ; re a high school teacher, so you' ; re not quilting full time all the time. ZF: It feels like it sometimes. Yeah. EP: So, yeah. How would you describe the work that you make now and where does that, " ; where does it end up" ; is really my favorite question about quilts. Like do you keep them, do you sell them, why are you doing it and what and what are you making? That' ; s a big question. Yeah. ZF: Why am I doing it? I can' ; t think of a better way to spend my time. It' ; s probably the honest answer, right? I really enjoy finding ways to bring new life to fabric and textiles. Another artist I really admire is Tijay Mohammed, who talks about the hopefulness of discarded objects. And I just love that. I think he thinks of it in terms mostly of people who get overlooked in the margins of society, which is definitely something on my mind. But I think you can also think of it on a more tangible level, which is just... I see here in Brooklyn especially, I just see, like clothes thrown out in the street like they' ; re trash, and if we were just to wind the clock back one hundred, one hundred fifty years, cloth is one of the most valuable things a person could have because it took so much labor to make that cloth. So to see it just so... produced in such a mass fashion and then just so easily discarded, something that' ; s just really bothersome to me on a personal level. So I love, I find a lot of gratification in giving new life and giving them a little something they didn' ; t have in their initial incarnation. So that' ; s that' ; s that' ; s a lot of my starting points for my work now is the fabrics themselves, what I run across, what I find. I love... Lately I' ; ve been making a few memorial quilts, memory quilts. I love thinking about the person that' ; s being honored in this, especially with their clothing and what that means. Whether I knew the person or not. I like to believe that you can tell something from somebody' ; s clothes. You know, even if you didn' ; t know them, like if you found the shirt that I' ; m wearing now, a little patch on the elbow, you' ; re like, " ; oh, he never, like, pushed the sleeves up all the way. He' ; s leaning on it and got..." ; . Or I just was recently deconstructing a shirt that somebody gave me and there was, in the front shirt pocket, there' ; s like a bunch of little like, mm, like little pieces of like soil and leaf matter and things like that, like they put something natural in their pocket, someone. I like to imagine this person walking through the woods or something like that. But I like starting with that point of inspiration, the fabric being the point of inspiration and going from there. And it' ; s important to me to remain open and sensitive to that process. I, like a lot of improv quilters, rarely have an idea of where the project' ; s going when I start. And quilting has taught me. I' ; m so thankful for this lesson because qolton has taught me that sensitivity is a virtue. I think for a long time I gave myself a hard time for being too sensitive to loud noises and strong smells and lots of people in a room, that kind of thing. EP: Sure. ZF: But now I realize that the other side of that same coin is when I look at my design wall and I can see, OK, here' ; s some fabric and here' ; s some fabric. But what' ; s the difference if I do this right and if that is what Ann Truitt calls it a " ; just noticeable difference" ; . Right? Like there is a difference there. Right? And what is it? And it' ; s that sensitivity that sometimes is not my best friend, but sometimes it' ; s my best friend that helped me see the difference. And so quilting has helped me accept that about myself as a person and also realize that that' ; s a virtue and a strength that I have as an artist. And so I' ; m very thankful for that. So being open to the process, starting with some fabric that has meaning and has some kind of substance in life of its own, being open to that, influencing the process, I would say informs almost all the pieces I make now. EP: That' ; s a fantastic answer, so I' ; m going to... I' ; m skipping ahead slightly: we typically ask folks to bring a touchstone quilt or sometimes it' ; s more than one. Do you want to share one quilt? Do you feel like you is a touchstone for your says something about your your work? ZF: Yeah, sure. Let' ; s start with this one. EP: Oh, perfect. ZF: This is not... I' ; m just going to say this is not the most beautiful quilt I' ; ve ever made, but it' ; s important for a reason because I can tell you a story about it. EP: Oh, those are the best ones. ZF: So you can edit all this part out, I' ; m sure. Right. EP: Sure. Even though this is the hanging process is equally fascinating to me. ZF: Well, yeah. Folks want to see all kinds of stuff. Yeah. All right. How' ; s that look to you. EP: That' ; s great. ZF: Pretty good? OK, yeah. ZF: So this is a quilt... Four years ago, 2016, like a lot of folks, like a little over half the country, I was really shocked at the way the 2016 election turned out. The president and I just don' ; t agree on a lot of things. And so after he won the Electoral College in 2016, I just felt like the rug had been pulled out from under me, a little bit lost at sea. So I didn' ; t sew for a long time, for several months and this is, what you see behind me is the first full size quilt I made after he was elected. So I had my little time of hibernation. I was laying low. I' ; m in the school. And this was one of the quilts that --I have a group of quilts, I have an approach maybe that I call " ; oracle quilting" ; because I either intentionally start with the question and I approach the fabric with that, or sometimes I just come and sit down, and sew. And then something, some kind of message comes through. It' ; s the latter one that happened with this quilt, because I didn' ; t sit down with any design in mind other than just like " ; I' ; m going to sew some colors I like together. And that' ; s going to make me a little happier by the end of the day than I was in the morning." ; And that was that was my goal. But I did that and I made this quilt and then I stepped back and looked at it on my design wall. And I mean, I don' ; t think it' ; s too grandiose to say I had a vision of the future when I when I saw it, right? It was this idea that even though we can' ; t see our way clear into the future, it' ; s still there. Right? And the future can still be bright. And so in my mind, what I saw when I look at this quilt, where all these orange squares like sunlight pouring in through a window so that all we have to do when we need that access to that new future is just 1), give it time, the time as a magic ingredient. And then, 2), we just got to step into it. Right? And so every time I look at this quilt, I see the presence of something better, more ideal than what we have now. That might not be immediately sensible, detectable, but it is there. And so I think that I look at this quilt and it brings me some comfort. EP: Yeah, that' ; s... It' ; s really timely. I' ; ll say that we are recording this on the day when we are awaiting news of of the 2020 election. So certainly this notion of the future and unknown is weighing heavily on my mind, at least. ZF: So I think it' ; s safe to say for a lot of us. EP: Exactly. Yeah. So you mentioned that this quilt was a comfort. Have you used, quiltmaking in the past to get through other difficult times? ZF: Yeah, let' ; s go back one. Let me put it... EP: Perfect. All right. We' ; re jumping all over. ZF: OK, so this quilt I, like I mentioned, didn' ; t sew much at all when when the president was first elected in 2016. But I could bring myself to sew small projects and I remember, it was January 2017. I had read this beautiful essay by Barbara Kingsolver. I love her. And she had written this one back in the 90' ; s when Bush won. And she was talking about how the flag is so often viewed or associated with one political party, viewed with Republicans, with conservatives, when in reality both parties have patriots, both parties have Americans. Both parties have people who are loyal to the country. And so she was making the argument that Democrats on the left need to reclaim the flag as one of their symbols as well. And so my response to reading that essay was to get on an online merchandise retailer whose name I won' ; t say on this... And order this flag, just 100% polyester made in China. And I' ; m like, I was just about to click a button when I was like, " ; Zak, what are you doing? You know how to sew." ; It' ; s like I' ; d forgotten because I hadn' ; t even made that other quilt that I' ; m showed you a second ago. I hadn' ; t done anything in months. And so I sat down and I made this flag right here. From there, I started having these responses to the fire of the day, you know, whatever news item there was, I would just, I would process it by making patches here. So you can see here Elizabeth Warren standing her ground, persisting. This came from an uncle of mine. A great American takes all of us. You know something... So many things, so many memories. It' ; s kind of like to me, a quilty newspaper or a quilted photo album. EP: Yeah, kind of time capsule. A little bit. Yeah. ZF: And so I stopped at the first hundred days. And so I took all the pieces I made after the first hundred days of his presidency and put them together in this " ; O America" ; quilt as a way of just saying, " ; come on folks we can do it. We just got to do it together." ; . EP: Yeah. Yeah, that' ; s it. ZF: And this is my favorite part. So this flag, I knew I wanted to use it. I love this flag. It' ; s got a lot of good mojo now because I' ; ve used it so often. I' ; ve taken it to protest and rallies and marches, all kinds of stuff. So I don' ; t want to permanently incorporate it. So it is safety pinned and there' ; s this panel underneath that holds that space. EP: I love that. ZF: Right? EP: Yeah. It' ; s got a designated place to come back to. And also still the message that the flags out there doing its work. ZF: Doing it' ; s work. Yeah, exactly. EP: It' ; s great. So this is a fairly large quilt. I don' ; t know how far past the frame it extends, and you live in Brooklyn. ZF: A little bit up, a little bit down. EP: OK, maybe you live in a small space. I' ; m going to I' ; m going to leap to assume, where... Can you describe the place where you make or your studio? ZF: Yeah. So I call it my studio, but in reality if you read between the lines, it' ; s just my eat-in kitchen. I' ; m looking at it now, I would show you, but it' ; s a disaster because I' ; m in the middle of like five, different projects right now. But one of the reasons we moved into this particular apartment is I have a very generous partner who says, OK, this partner, this, this apartment has an eat-in kitchen. That' ; ll be a good space for you to work. Because it' ; s just a one bedroom. We really got great. And so in that space is my cutting slash ironing table and my little sewing table. And on the back wall, I finally got the design wall that people love to have. And having a design wall does make a difference. Right? Like, there is a beautiful thing about being able to step back twenty feet and just see everything smaller. EP: Sure, yeah. ZF: So it was helpful for me to have. I' ; m constantly trying not to accumulate materials, but it' ; s hard because everything I see I want to salvage and give new life to whether that' ; s fabric, or I' ; m also into natural dyeing. And so I have a lot of flowers and barks and things in there sittin around. But I try my best stay on top of the mess and try not to be a hoarder. And then when it gets too much I just start passing it along. You know, or trying to, at least. EP: Yeah, that' ; s a it' ; s a tricky balance between sort of hoarding and collecting what seems useful. And I think when you have an interest in -- I have a real interest in ' ; stuff ; which I think people think is maybe a little consumerism-y. But I really just think that objects have such delightful... It' ; s hard, it' ; s hard to walk that line between accumulation and use. Definitely, for sure. ZF: You know, one rule of thumb, that I don' ; t follow, my partner is better at it than I am. But he loves books and so he tries to, if he brings a book into the house, one goes out the house,. EP: The one in, one out. It' ; s so good in theory. I. ZF: It' ; s a great theory, yeah, we should try it sometime maybe. EP: Yeah. I every every year. I think this is going to be my one in, one out year and it' ; s usually like five in, sometimes something goes out, you know. ZF: Maybe, just maybe it' ; s just easier to move to a bigger space. EP: I think the one in, one out is me moving out of my house and moving into a larger space there. EP: I' ; ll can work on that. So. So, yeah, it sounds like you' ; re, you live with the work and you kind of balance your space. How how do you balance your time? ZF: Oh, you know, it' ; s tough with a full time job. Yeah, it really is. It' ; s been a little bit easier in the last several months because so much of my time has been spent working from home, doing remote education. So between classes, it' ; s a lot easier, just like whip out a quilt and a little work done. Here in New York we have gone back and I' ; m one of the teachers who goes back in the building every day. So that fun time came to an end, unfortunately. So I, I try my best. And that usually looks like, in the evenings I get about a half hour to an hour of time to work. Usually on the weekends I get to devote one whole day, usually it' ; s Sunday to sewing projects, to really make some good headway. And I try to get to a point where throughout the rest of the week I can just do like the production aspect. So like Sunday it tends to be my big creative, big vision day. I make a plan for the week so that on Monday through Friday I just sit there and crank out a little piece I need for the following Sunday when I go back to the bigger steps again. EP: Do you do you feel like your life as a teacher, and your life as a quiltmaker, intersect in any way, either in sort of the skills you use or like do your students know about your quilts? ZF: My students do know about my quilts because I take them in from time to time to show them. Do they intersect? EP: It' ; s fine if they don' ; t, I' ; m just curious. ZF: You know, but let' ; s see if we can find a way where the Venn diagram overlaps, I do think... In the sense that my quilts are often... Contain a message, they teach in that sense, right, they carry some kind of meaning. I think there' ; s something there that we could we could hang our hats on. I also think that quilting has.. I' ; m also into fermentation. So quilting and fermentation both have shown me that time is a magic ingredient. Like I said a moment ago, that things happen that can only happen if given time. And I think teaching would also fall in that category. Like you can' ; t force a human, a student in your class to perform well on a certain day, no matter how how well you set them up for success. But one hopes that over the course of your time together, your course of nine months together, that you can move them from here to here. We' ; re patient. We do our best. We wait and see. EP: Yeah, I think that' ; s a great, that' ; s those are great places for the Venn diagram to overlap for sure. Let' ; s see. I have so many questions I want to ask. Do you... I' ; m curious if you feel like you work in a in a community of quilters. I mean, I think I first found out about your work as part of the 43 for 43 project, which is a community project. Do you feel like you are working in a community and do you do you enjoy that, any kind of collaborative work or or do you take sort of a head down solo approach? Is this where you feel more comfortable? ZF: You know, it' ; s one foot in and one foot out, like it feels like, for folks who know the areas, like when you go to Carowinds in North Carolina, South Carolina, you get to straddle the state line. You know, left foot in North Carolina, right foot in South Carolina. I value strongly community, and I think at this point in my life, most of that is through social media. Which can also be a challenging thing for me at times, I mean, those who follow me online will know that I post something, sometimes I' ; ll get on like a daily kick and sometimes I don' ; t post for a couple of weeks or a couple of months if we' ; re honest. And it can be tough because there are times when when I' ; m in my darker days and I' ; m scrolling through Instagram like " ; how people are doing such good work and I am wasting my life" ; , you know, that goes through the noggin. And I never want to I never want my work to be that for somebody else. So I' ; m like " ; ahh, no more social media!" ; . But then I start missing my friends and I want to see what people are doing. So then I come back, you know, so it' ; s an ebb and flow thing. I do like collaboration. In fact, this quilt behind me, Heidi Parkes, helped me, and Heidi Parkse also interviewed with you all at one point. And she helped me do a lot of this embroidery. We kind of did like a crazy quilt Americana type thing. I' ; m working on a postal collaboration right now with the local textile artist and we are working on the square that we just mailed back and forth. And we just add a little section and then when it gets too big for an envelope, we just start over. You know, I would like to do more collaborations because I love that. The 43 for 43 project--just a quick 10 seconds for folks who don' ; t know it, there were forty three teaching students, college students, in Mexico and in 2014, 2016, Minutes that disappeared one night they were booked and disappeared. And so folks down to Mexico for a long time been trying to raise awareness about, hey, where are these folks? We want them back. You know, the government will tell me that. ZF: And so when I was down there a few years ago, I was just so struck and impressed by how hard people were working to make sure these people were remembered and the justice was found for them that when I came back--and I should say that I was struck when I went down to Mexico on that particular trip that, when I learned what the number forty three meant, because you saw ' ; 43' ; everywhere, it was like graffiti on walls and scratched on restaurant tables. When I realized what 43 meant, I had this, this this vague memory of scrolling past a headline on a screen months before and not clicking, not reading, not like--how can we? We can' ; t read about everything all the time. Sure. But I was like, dag, it' ; s good to be in the first world, it' ; s good to be in the United States. It' ; s good to be where, for the most part, we hopefully feel safe and comfortable, you know. So all of that went to my mind. I' ; m like, OK, so if I missed this one, and I' ; m someone who' ; s interested in Mexico, Mexican history, Mexican culture, Mexican people. I' ; m sure other people missed it, too. So I came back to the US and organized this 43 for 43 project in which I rallied... well it turned, out more than forty three, because in the end I think we had maybe sixty four participants and everybody made a square for one of the boys that disappeared. People embroidered their portraits like Heidi embroidered a portrait for one of the guys that everybody put their names on there. A lot of appliqué was done, and we made it into a long quilted protest banner. But then I took to Mexico City with me and with a mediator, helped get it to the families for whatever purposes they need to in the streets or to hang somewhere. So I love collaborative projects like that because I do believe that there are things that can only happen when we' ; re working together. And I would like to find... I got ideas. I mean I mean always it' ; s good to be me because I got ideas, but the thing is, I just don' ; t have the time necessarily to organize these things. But I am hopeful that one day I will because I really enjoyed the role of organizer and I enjoyed being the person that literally pieced it all together and thinking of ways to raise awareness, and to use my time and my talent in ways that hopefully leaves us a little bit better than it was before I plopped down in nineteen eighty. EP: That' ; s, that' ; s a great that' ; s a great answer and great I think admirable goal. You mentioned... I mean many of your quilts have have messages. Is there... Why do you think that quilts are uniquely suited or rather, do you think that quilts are uniquely suited, for carrying a message? ZF: Yeah. Oh one hundred percent. And I think it has to do with just how domestic they are. Right. All forms of art, I think, have something special or unique that only they can do, right, that' ; s why they exist. I would say one of the things that only quilting can do is take something so domestic, something so accessible, something that would otherwise perhaps be wasted, thrown away in the garbage by trash can and turn into something else. And especially if we' ; re thinking of some kind of community quilting, activism, quilting, political quilting. There' ; s ways to say here, for example, here are some things that really matter to me in my heart of hearts. This is what I carry around me on a daily basis. So I' ; m going to reach into my drawers. I' ; m going to take out my clothes and cut them up, and then I' ; m going to make something beautiful to show you right in a similar way. In Latin America, there' ; s a protest tradition of the cacerolazo, which is started often with women and when it was time to take the streets, protest, something they didn' ; t do a whole lot of organizing and then like funding super PACs and all this kind of thing. They just went to the kitchen drawer, pulled out a pot and a wooden spoon and went to the street banging. Right. Like it' ; s taking what' ; s in our hearts, readily accessible, democratic, and taking it public and put it out there in the community. And so I think that' ; s something that makes quilting especially suited for community engagement, for the public forum, and for sharing what' ; s on the inside with everyone on the outside. EP: That' ; s a great answer, I think. Yeah, that' ; s they have so many things going for them and kind of sometimes are a little unassuming, which is really nice and sort of soft, a soft way to get our point across. ZF: So I think someone who' ; s an expert at that is Kathryn Clark. I don' ; t know if folks are familiar with her work, but she has a way of taking, like, she made... (I' ; m blanking). There... She made this quilt recently about inequities in rent stabilization or apartments, something like that, folks can look her up, maybe you can edit this part out, but folks can look her up. EP: We' ; ll share some photos. ZF: Yeah, show us the photos, because she has a way of taking these hard truths and making them into soft fabric, literally, and it makes you want to say, " ; hey, what are all these little squares representing, what' ; s going on here? What' ; s the story?" ; And you sit back and you think like, " ; well, dang, was tough..." ; You know? She' ; s an expert at that. And I hate that I' ; m blanking on the critical detail right now. No, that' ; s all right. It' ; ll come to me as soon as we click " ; End meeting" ; . EP: It always happens. So you' ; ve talked you talked about a few names, Heidi Parkes and Kathryn Clark and Irene Williams. Is there other folks or other sort of moments or anything--it doesn' ; t have to be quilting related--that you' ; re you' ; re really drawn to or have been inspiring you lately? ZF: Well, I would say I mean, the answers that come first to mind are Irene Williams are Heidi Parkes. I think Heidi does a wonderful job of turning the inside out, you know, and using her life and her body in ways to produce work that is very personal. And I think that' ; s something that ,as artists, we should all strive for, you know, like what' ; s what' ; s the one thing that only I can do and let me do that. And I think I did a really great model of that Tijay Muhammad, I mentioned earlier who makes wonderful, I mean, he wouldn' ; t consider himself a quilter, but he does use a lot of fabric. And he recently made a bunch of really lovely textile portraits of people that are close to him. And he' ; s from Ghana. So he' ; s working in this African tradition, it' ; s really lovely. And he' ; s the one that mentioned the " ; hopefulness of discarded objects" ; . You know, I just love that. And there' ; s always writers, too, you know, I love like Emerson, for example, I was I' ; m working on this piece for Feel Good Fibers for their blog about the role that beauty plays in our work. Like is enough just to make a beautiful something or does it need to have more meaning? And I think the inspiration for what got me thinking down that line was Emerson, who wrote this really beautiful poem to the rhododendron, right? He' ; s walking through the woods of Massachusetts, he sees this rhododendron and he says that " ; if the sages come and ask you, like, why do you exist, rhododendron? All you have to say: is beauty is not excuse for being" ; Like beauty is enough, you know? And so I feel like sometimes I' ; m working and I' ; m like, OK, if this particular project doesn' ; t have capital-M Meaning? That' ; s OK, Emerson gave me permission to say, if it' ; s beautiful, that' ; s enough. And so I would lump Emerson in there with Thoreau, definitely is one my a huge influences. I love it. He' ; s trying to see through the shifting sands of what was happening during the eighteen hundreds and try to predict where we' ; re going and try to see where we' ; re where we' ; re coming from. I mentioned Barbara Kingsolver. I love her nonfiction essays and I love poetry too. Right. I mean, who doesn' ; t love like Mary Oliver with her Wild Geese poem? I read a lot, but yeah, so there' ; s a few names folks want to.... EP: Yeah. ZF: The glimpse of some of my input. EP: That' ; s great. Yeah, I mean, it' ; s it' ; s so interesting sometimes to hear how people funnel all their different parts of their life in their brain and into what they' ; re thinking about. So this next question is a doozy. I' ; d love to ask it, but it' ; s really, it' ; s a challenge. But what do you think makes a great quilt? ZF: Hmm... I' ; m going to say that,you know, quilt, art can be different things, great quilts can be great art and great quilts can be great quilts, right? Soit depends on how we want to frame the question. I think a great quilt is anything that is made with care and attention, anything that brings pleasure to the person making it and pleasure to the person receiving it. I think if it meets that criteria, then it' ; s a great quilt right? Now, if we want to frame it a little bit larger, if we want to zoom out or maybe zoomin' ; in, I don' ; t know what direction we' ; re zoomin' ; , but I think about what makes good quilt as art... Emerson says beauty is enough and I' ; m inclined to agree with that, but I think the reason I' ; m drawn to quilting is it is not just beautiful. It also has utility, but it also has a function. It keeps us warm. It tells stories. It' ; s a way to for us to live on just a little bit, you know. Anne Truitt, who is a sculptor that some of our listeners may know is known for her almost human-size, five or six feet tall, four-sided columns made out of wood, and somebody was asking, why do you work in wood? She says, well, it has about the same lifespan as human being. And I think did the same thing applies to fabric, right, that we create these beautiful things that with with one hopes it' ; s used right, gets loved and doesn' ; t last that much longer than we do, but it can last a little bit. And I think, that when I think of great quilts, there' ; s something about the fact that they' ; re impermanent that also comes into play. They' ; re fragile and they' ; re delicate things. And because they' ; re meant to be used, they break down faster. And I think there' ; s something in that natural decomposition that is beautiful and something to aspire towards, so that' ; s a good answer. EP: No, that' ; s a great answer. ZF: Off the top of my head. EP: No, it it' ; s not an easy question. And I always feel a little devious for asking it, because I think it' ; s sort of honestly sort of a cruel question. But it always we always get great answers. I mean, it' ; s so fascinating to hear people' ; s variety of notions of what that means and what greatness means. Where, where do most of the quilts that you make end up? Do you keep them or do you sell them? Do you and where what is the dream for their future that they that they do decompose or that they' ; re preserved forever? ZF: Well, a you know, a quilter' ; s got to live so about half have been sold. EP: Sure, I think we sometimes people are skittish about talking about this, but it' ; s a huge part of the quilt-making world. So, yeah. ZF: So about half have been sold, they' ; re out there in the world, doing their thing, living their lives on people' ; s beds, folded over their banisters on walls or whatever folks do with them. The other half are folded up in a big pile in my bedroom. In our little tiny one bedroom Brooklyn apartment, there is along one wall a long arm machine that I got several years ago. If you were to ask me what my least favorite part of quilting is--don' ; t hate me for this--I don' ; t like to quilt, like the actual quilting. EP: I' ; m with you! If I could, if I can make a quilt and never quilt it, that' ; ll be great now, which I guess is possible, you know. ZF: And so that' ; s why I got the long arm, because I' ; m like, OK, that makes the least unsavory part of the process for me a little bit easier. And honestly, like all my quilts get quilted the same way, unless I' ; m hand-quilting them, if it' ; s machine quilting it' ; s just parallel lines. Because I just want to, I want the quilting itself to disappear and I want the forms and the colors of the quilt top to come forward. So, oh, you' ; re asking where do the quilts end up? So along one bedroom, blocking the window with our fire escape (probably not safe) is the long arm machine. And there' ; s a stack of probably two dozen quilts folded up there. At some point in the future I would love to have a space where I can display them, hang them on walls. EP: I think this is also a timely question given the quilt you have behind you, but people typically refer to quilts as a uniquely American art. You can, we can we can, argue about that until the cows come home. But that' ; s kind of the notion. What do you think that is the importance of quilts in American life? Do they... That' ; s, that' ; s a that' ; s a loaded question, but if you want to talk a little bit about that. ZF: I do love, and it kind of circles back to a few moments ago. But I do love that quilting is not usually something that' ; s done in a studio, is not done in a separate space. Usually it' ; s done in people' ; s homes, it is the heart. I mean, when you think of the most private place in your home, I got two places, one is the toilet, the other one for the bed, right? Like, when you think of the most, the heart of your home, I would argue, is your bed. And we' ; re talking about making things for that space. And so when we choose to share that space with the outside world, there' ; s a potential for something really special that, you know, so when you combine the fact that you' ; re taking something that ought to be private and you' ; re making it public and you' ; re working with something that everybody can identify with, everyone was close by. Everybody wears fabric. It' ; s our second skin, our second home. When you can make it something tangible that people can connect with sometimes I think something can unlock or shifted, the needle can move a little bit, and so at a time when we are having trouble communicating, and by " ; we" ; I mean Americans, are having trouble communicating with one another. There has to be some room in quilting for us to have something deeper than a conversation, like something that helps us reconnect with what truly are our core values as Americans. I believe that almost all of us would think that goodness is an American value. Compromise. has been a long American value. Consensus-building, working together, getting the job done. I mean, these are things that we could really agree on. So the thing that happens, though, is that we disagree on the words to use. Right. So maybe we take words out of the equation. We just pick up some fabric and needle and thread instead. And let' ; s see what happens if we work together on that. I don' ; t know what that looks like. It' ; s been something I' ; ve been puzzling on, but I think there' ; s space in the United States right now for some really powerful quilting projects that. EP: Well, that is... I can' ; t wait to see them. I really hope that those will come out of this moment. So it has been really a delight to talk to you. Is there anything you want to add or that you didn' ; t didn' ; t feel like you got to share or anything else? ZF: No, I want to say thank you for this opportunity to talk. Thank you. It' ; s always nice to talk to a like-minded soul, and I want to thank folks for listening to this whole thing, I. I got a lot of questions, you know, about how how life works. So if anything that folks have heard today in our conversation, it sparked an idea, I would love to hear from people. So maybe we can figure out a way to connect somehow. Absolutely. Because I do think that when we all put our heads together, we can see things a little more clearly, you know? No, I appreciate it, I' ; m very thankful for this time. EP: Yeah, well, thank you, I am I' ; m supposed to say that we have concluded our interview at three fifty two p.m. I didn' ; t actually say when we started it, so that' ; s it' ; s not that helpful. But yeah, that is, that was really fantastic. Thank you so much. < ; begin subtitles> ; 00:07:10:15 00:07:11:15 So let's 00:07:12:17 00:07:14:07 just jump right in with this very 00:07:14:10 00:07:16:14 first question: tell me about 00:07:16:15 00:07:18:06 your interest in quiltmaking and how 00:07:18:07 00:07:19:06 you got started making quilts. 00:07:20:07 00:07:21:10 Yeah, you know, I think 00:07:22:07 00:07:23:20 for a long time I was an artist 00:07:24:04 00:07:25:07 in search of quilting. 00:07:25:13 00:07:26:13 You know, I grew up 00:07:27:09 00:07:28:09 in North Carolina. 00:07:28:12 00:07:30:02 And North Carolina, as you know, has 00:07:30:03 00:07:31:13 a long tradition of producing 00:07:31:22 00:07:32:18 textiles, right? 00:07:32:19 00:07:33:23 Right up into the eighties and kind 00:07:33:24 00:07:35:03 of mid-eighties, it kind of petered 00:07:35:04 00:07:36:16 out. So I grew up 00:07:37:03 00:07:38:12 surrounded in this landscape of 00:07:38:13 00:07:39:25 textiles, but I didn't really have a 00:07:40:00 00:07:41:03 personal connection. 00:07:41:10 00:07:43:05 I know that my mom had a sewing 00:07:43:06 00:07:44:24 machine when I grew up, but I didn't 00:07:45:04 00:07:46:08 really see it being used that much. 00:07:46:19 00:07:48:01 My first sewing memory was 00:07:48:18 00:07:50:13 with her mom, who is now 00:07:50:20 00:07:51:19 a hundred and four years old, still kickin' 00:07:51:20 00:07:52:19 and wonderful. 00:07:53:12 00:07:55:02 And I remember going to her house 00:07:55:13 00:07:57:10 once and seeing that she was making 00:07:57:11 00:07:59:07 a dress and being so 00:07:59:10 00:08:01:07 fascinated. I was probably like five 00:08:01:08 00:08:02:13 years old or so, being so fascinated 00:08:02:14 00:08:03:23 with pattern paper, clothing 00:08:04:02 00:08:05:03 pattern, paper like that, this 00:08:05:05 00:08:06:05 brown, thin... 00:08:06:10 00:08:07:10 Just so fragile. 00:08:07:18 00:08:09:16 And I'm like, oh, sewing is so 00:08:09:17 00:08:11:04 mysterious, you know, like how do we 00:08:11:11 00:08:13:01 take these raw materials and make 00:08:13:02 00:08:13:24 something? 00:08:14:00 00:08:16:02 But then I didn't do 00:08:16:08 00:08:17:11 anything with fabric. 00:08:17:20 00:08:19:09 Hmmm... for about twenty, twenty 00:08:19:20 00:08:20:20 five years. 00:08:21:18 00:08:23:19 I do a lot of drawing. 00:08:23:20 00:08:25:16 I tried painting, screen printing, 00:08:26:12 00:08:27:17 lithographs, I mean all kinds of 00:08:27:18 00:08:28:18 stuff. Right? 00:08:28:19 00:08:30:13 And it seemed like I kind of bounced 00:08:30:19 00:08:32:06 from one to the other for the 00:08:32:07 00:08:33:05 longest while. 00:08:33:06 00:08:35:05 And then one day, about 00:08:36:00 00:08:38:12 six or seven years ago now, my 00:08:38:13 00:08:39:22 friends started having their 00:08:40:08 00:08:41:18 first kids, you know? 00:08:41:19 00:08:43:07 And so I was like, " ; OK, this is a 00:08:43:08 00:08:44:17 time for me to try 00:08:45:03 00:08:46:06 to make a quilt again" ; . 00:08:46:08 00:08:47:15 I had made one in college. 00:08:49:05 00:08:50:14 It didn't line up all perfect and 00:08:50:18 00:08:52:02 square so I thought was a total failure. 00:08:52:03 00:08:53:19 And I just tossed it the side, 00:08:54:02 00:08:55:07 and we come back to that quilt in a 00:08:55:08 00:08:56:08 little bit if you want. 00:08:56:09 00:08:57:08 But I didn't quilt 00:08:58:04 00:08:59:23 between college and five or seven 00:08:59:24 00:09:01:01 years ago. I didn't quilt for nearly 00:09:01:02 00:09:02:01 a decade and I 00:09:02:22 00:09:03:22 picked it back up with baby quilts 00:09:04:08 00:09:06:02 and I've been hooked ever since, 00:09:06:06 00:09:07:06 so that's, kind of... 00:09:07:25 00:09:09:23 I didn't learn 00:09:09:24 00:09:11:24 from anybody, my family, really, 00:09:11:25 00:09:12:25 I... 00:09:13:22 00:09:15:06 Well, that's not true, so I did 00:09:15:07 00:09:16:15 learn a lot on YouTube. But my 00:09:16:16 00:09:18:21 partner's mamaw in eastern Tennessee 00:09:19:00 00:09:20:18 was a big time quilter. 00:09:21:02 00:09:22:02 And so I 00:09:23:09 00:09:25:01 learned the basics online. 00:09:25:02 00:09:26:12 But every holiday when we'd come 00:09:26:13 00:09:27:20 home for Thanksgiving, especially, 00:09:28:03 00:09:29:17 we would sit and talk about like, 00:09:29:22 00:09:30:22 oh, how do you do your binding? 00:09:31:10 00:09:32:18 She does that East Appalachian kind 00:09:32:19 00:09:33:20 of thing where you, like, roll the 00:09:33:21 00:09:35:06 back up over the top. 00:09:35:07 00:09:36:05 Oh, yeah. 00:09:36:06 00:09:38:03 And those little 00:09:38:04 00:09:39:23 details I remember one time coming 00:09:39:24 00:09:41:14 home from Thanksgiving Day, part of 00:09:41:15 00:09:43:02 our family tradition is going to the 00:09:43:03 00:09:44:07 movies after the big meal. 00:09:45:01 00:09:45:23 Mamaw never did. 00:09:45:24 00:09:46:20 She stayed home to clean the 00:09:46:21 00:09:48:19 kitchen. Like, I don't know 00:09:48:20 00:09:50:16 how you get to cook the meal 00:09:50:17 00:09:51:16 and get stuck in the kitchen... 00:09:51:19 00:09:52:14 Yeah, that's a raw deal. 00:09:52:15 00:09:54:17 But Mamaw, I guess 00:09:55:11 00:09:56:14 she was fine with it. She got to see 00:09:56:15 00:09:57:14 her grandbabies. 00:09:58:05 00:09:59:10 But I came back from the movies that 00:09:59:11 00:10:00:07 night and she was sitting at the 00:10:00:08 00:10:01:17 kitchen table with this quilt of 00:10:01:18 00:10:03:01 mine that I brought to work on and 00:10:04:01 00:10:05:00 she was just sewing that binding, 00:10:05:01 00:10:07:03 and I treasure that quilt because 00:10:07:04 00:10:08:08 I can look at those stitches and 00:10:08:09 00:10:09:08 know those aren't 00:10:10:06 00:10:11:06 those aren't my stitches. 00:10:11:07 00:10:12:06 Bless her heart, her eyes at that time 00:10:12:24 00:10:14:07 weren't the best, but it's like it's 00:10:14:08 00:10:15:23 her signature there in the quilt. 00:10:16:05 00:10:17:22 I just, I treasure it's a beautiful 00:10:17:24 00:10:18:16 thing. 00:10:18:17 00:10:19:21 Helping with binding really is... 00:10:19:23 00:10:21:08 That's an that's an act of love for 00:10:21:09 00:10:22:09 sure. Always 00:10:23:04 00:10:24:05 my least favorite part. 00:10:24:06 00:10:25:20 But so... 00:10:25:21 00:10:27:07 before you started quilting, did you 00:10:27:08 00:10:29:10 have sort of a notion 00:10:29:11 00:10:30:15 or idea about quilts and 00:10:31:06 00:10:32:02 who made quilts? 00:10:32:03 00:10:33:22 I mean, did you, did that, 00:10:34:05 00:10:35:19 do you have any preconceived ideas 00:10:35:20 00:10:37:04 about that or was it just something 00:10:37:05 00:10:38:22 that was, you 00:10:39:03 00:10:41:13 did once, you thought " ; meh" ; or 00:10:41:19 00:10:43:18 it was a continually evolving idea? 00:10:46:13 00:10:48:09 I think, OK, so if 00:10:48:10 00:10:49:14 if I'm being honest, the 00:10:50:13 00:10:52:04 very first quilt I ever made was a 00:10:52:05 00:10:53:16 four square patch 00:10:54:09 00:10:56:01 made in the third grade because we 00:10:56:03 00:10:57:16 had, like Laura Ingalls Wilder day 00:10:57:17 00:10:58:23 at school. We just read 00:10:59:12 00:11:00:08 Little House on the Prairie. I'm 00:11:00:09 00:11:01:11 like, oh, we're going to these 00:11:01:12 00:11:02:15 activities. So Zach made him a 00:11:02:16 00:11:04:09 little four square patch that turned 00:11:04:14 00:11:05:24 into a pillow. And that was cute. 00:11:07:17 00:11:09:14 But I think I didn't go any further, 00:11:09:15 00:11:10:25 my third grade self, because in my 00:11:10:26 00:11:12:12 mind, quilts 00:11:12:23 00:11:14:09 were often like, 00:11:15:15 00:11:16:15 poofy. 00:11:16:17 00:11:18:13 I'm not that, well, 00:11:18:16 00:11:19:15 I don't say nothing about polyester 00:11:19:16 00:11:21:05 fill, but it was not the best for 00:11:21:07 00:11:22:17 the planet. But if you like your 00:11:22:18 00:11:23:19 quilts poofy, that's fine. 00:11:23:23 00:11:25:08 But that was the image I had in my 00:11:25:09 00:11:26:21 mind. And so it took a long time 00:11:27:07 00:11:28:15 for me to realize, oh, there's other 00:11:28:16 00:11:30:03 things you can fill quilts with. 00:11:32:03 00:11:32:13 Sure. 00:11:32:14 00:11:33:14 I also thought quilts had to be patterned, right? 00:11:33:20 00:11:35:17 But now we have seen in the last 00:11:35:25 00:11:37:09 many, many years that there's many 00:11:37:10 00:11:38:09 different ways to be a quilt. 00:11:38:17 00:11:39:24 And I'm thankful for that. 00:11:40:12 00:11:41:12 Yeah, that's that is so 00:11:42:10 00:11:43:17 true. There are so many ways to be a 00:11:43:25 00:11:44:25 quilt. 00:11:45:13 00:11:47:00 And you mentioned you learned a 00:11:47:03 00:11:48:15 little bit with with Memaw, and a 00:11:48:16 00:11:50:19 little bit on 00:11:50:20 00:11:51:16 YouTube. 00:11:51:17 00:11:53:14 How how did you really come to 00:11:53:15 00:11:54:21 start making quilts, and what were 00:11:54:22 00:11:56:10 you looking at in those early days 00:11:56:11 00:11:57:19 to get a sense of the process? 00:12:02:00 00:12:03:05 In the early days, I was 00:12:03:22 00:12:05:00 just trying to find patterns that I 00:12:05:01 00:12:06:11 liked, you know, I would basically 00:12:06:12 00:12:08:11 just like replicate some 00:12:08:12 00:12:09:17 tried and true Monkey Wrench or 00:12:09:18 00:12:11:04 something, you know, Pinwheel. 00:12:11:23 00:12:12:23 My very first 00:12:13:19 00:12:15:10 quilt I saw to fruition all the way 00:12:15:11 00:12:16:19 through from patching to binding 00:12:17:09 00:12:18:09 was a Pinwheel quilt. 00:12:20:02 00:12:21:07 But some things have held 00:12:22:02 00:12:24:00 in common from that first baby quilt 00:12:24:02 00:12:25:15 because I sourced a lot of that 00:12:25:16 00:12:27:10 fabric from remnants 00:12:27:11 00:12:28:19 and salvage and things like that. 00:12:28:20 00:12:29:23 Using repurposed materials is 00:12:29:24 00:12:30:23 still... 00:12:31:12 00:12:33:04 ninety-nine percent of what I use 00:12:33:05 00:12:34:05 when I work now, 00:12:35:16 00:12:36:25 but in the beginning I was like, 00:12:36:26 00:12:38:05 " ; let me play by the rules" ; . 00:12:38:09 00:12:39:19 I wanted to learn the rules. 00:12:40:12 00:12:41:14 And learn the techniques. 00:12:41:18 00:12:43:06 And I just I made really pretty 00:12:43:18 00:12:45:13 precise all-my-corners-met kind of 00:12:45:14 00:12:46:13 quilt. 00:12:46:16 00:12:47:24 And then it didn't take too 00:12:48:16 00:12:50:06 long before I discovered the quilts 00:12:50:11 00:12:51:07 of Gee's Bend. 00:12:51:08 00:12:52:08 And 00:12:53:06 00:12:54:21 they obviously continue to have... 00:12:54:22 00:12:56:13 For folks that are already familiar 00:12:56:14 00:12:58:03 with my work, continue to have an 00:12:58:12 00:13:00:08 influence on 00:13:00:17 00:13:02:04 on my work and on my approach. 00:13:02:05 00:13:03:05 And 00:13:04:02 00:13:05:17 a question I have in my mind that 00:13:05:19 00:13:07:11 remains unresolved--and if anybody 00:13:07:19 00:13:09:01 out there has thought so, 00:13:09:24 00:13:11:16 I'm on a search to figure this 00:13:11:17 00:13:13:08 out--but, you know, there is there 00:13:13:09 00:13:14:25 is the issue, in my mind at least, 00:13:15:00 00:13:16:22 about appropriating quilts 00:13:17:06 00:13:18:22 that have come out of that part of 00:13:18:25 00:13:19:25 Alabama. 00:13:21:02 00:13:22:16 And it's weird for me as a white 00:13:22:25 00:13:24:22 male in this field to be 00:13:24:23 00:13:26:08 saying, like, " ; oh, I love these. 00:13:26:09 00:13:27:08 These quilts are beautiful" ; . 00:13:27:09 00:13:28:09 And how do 00:13:29:05 00:13:30:23 we, how do I, 00:13:31:16 00:13:33:01 pay homage and respect to that 00:13:33:02 00:13:34:24 tradition and the 00:13:35:12 00:13:37:09 latitude that those women 00:13:37:16 00:13:38:22 (and one man, as far as I know) 00:13:39:05 00:13:40:12 opened up with their design 00:13:40:13 00:13:42:07 approaches, how do I pay respect and 00:13:42:14 00:13:43:18 homage to that without appropriating 00:13:43:19 00:13:45:10 it? That's one thing that I think of 00:13:45:17 00:13:47:08 quite a bit. But when I saw those 00:13:47:09 00:13:48:18 quilts from Gee's Bend, I was 00:13:49:04 00:13:50:04 like: here we go. 00:13:50:15 00:13:51:20 There's some breathing room in this 00:13:51:21 00:13:52:20 art form. 00:13:53:09 00:13:54:21 And I think especially if I had 00:13:55:05 00:13:56:19 to put my finger on one quilter 00:13:57:00 00:13:58:13 specifically is Irene Williams, 00:14:00:05 00:14:01:05 she's my spiritual quilting 00:14:01:09 00:14:02:21 grandmother, I would like to think, 00:14:02:22 00:14:03:22 if she'd have me. 00:14:04:17 00:14:06:13 She worked a lot 00:14:06:14 00:14:07:21 in solitude. She worked a lot by 00:14:07:22 00:14:09:15 herself, not as communal 00:14:09:22 00:14:11:02 as some of the other ladies. 00:14:11:09 00:14:13:02 And she was just like, 00:14:13:07 00:14:14:14 " ; I'm going to do what I want to do" ; . 00:14:14:15 00:14:15:18 Like she's... One of my favorite 00:14:15:19 00:14:18:01 quilts of hers are two basketball 00:14:18:02 00:14:19:16 jerseys that she cut up the side 00:14:19:20 00:14:20:20 seams, right? 00:14:22:19 00:14:23:23 There's another one there where she 00:14:23:24 00:14:25:06 took a bright orange poncho and 00:14:25:07 00:14:26:14 just, like, sewed the hood down 00:14:26:15 00:14:28:05 flat. She even, like, 00:14:28:13 00:14:30:01 try to, like, cut the fabric out. 00:14:30:02 00:14:31:01 She just told the hood down. I 00:14:32:13 00:14:33:13 love the, 00:14:34:21 00:14:35:23 the space that she had 00:14:36:18 00:14:37:25 around her work to create 00:14:39:20 00:14:41:06 and so... So when I saw her work, 00:14:41:07 00:14:42:07 I'm like, " ; yeah, there's something 00:14:42:08 00:14:43:10 fun we can do here with this" ; . 00:14:43:13 00:14:44:14 And so I've been kind of searching 00:14:44:15 00:14:46:04 ever since. Like what? 00:14:46:05 00:14:48:01 What else can we do with this art 00:14:48:02 00:14:48:19 form? 00:14:48:20 00:14:50:04 Sure. That's a that's a great 00:14:50:13 00:14:51:12 question and a great journey. 00:14:51:13 00:14:53:17 And I think a lot of people, maybe 00:14:54:07 00:14:55:10 struggle a little bit with that 00:14:55:11 00:14:56:15 notion of Gee's Bend and 00:14:56:18 00:14:58:09 appropriation? And I think in the 00:14:58:12 00:14:59:15 early days, particularly of the 00:14:59:16 00:15:00:24 Modern Quilt movement, there was a 00:15:01:00 00:15:01:24 lot of.. 00:15:02:11 00:15:03:20 a little bit of wrestling with that, 00:15:04:17 00:15:05:15 maybe acknowledged or 00:15:05:16 00:15:07:01 unacknowledged, so I'm really 00:15:07:08 00:15:08:08 interested to hear you talk about 00:15:08:09 00:15:09:09 that. 00:15:09:21 00:15:11:02 So your early quilts were really 00:15:11:03 00:15:11:23 precise. 00:15:11:24 00:15:13:09 How would you describe your work 00:15:13:10 00:15:14:14 now? I mean, are you... 00:15:14:24 00:15:16:12 You mentioned you're a high school 00:15:16:13 00:15:18:06 teacher, so you're not quilting full 00:15:18:14 00:15:19:14 time all the time. 00:15:20:06 00:15:21:04 It feels like it sometimes. 00:15:21:05 00:15:22:00 Yeah. 00:15:22:01 00:15:22:23 So, yeah. 00:15:22:24 00:15:24:22 How would you describe the work 00:15:24:23 00:15:26:18 that you make now and 00:15:26:19 00:15:28:01 where does that, " ; where does it end 00:15:28:02 00:15:29:17 up" ; is really my favorite question 00:15:29:18 00:15:31:04 about quilts. Like do you keep them, 00:15:31:05 00:15:32:04 do you sell them, 00:15:34:14 00:15:35:16 why are you doing it 00:15:36:10 00:15:37:17 and what and what are you making? 00:15:37:22 00:15:38:22 That's a big question. 00:15:38:23 00:15:39:22 Yeah. 00:15:41:22 00:15:43:01 Why am I doing it? I can't think of 00:15:43:02 00:15:44:02 a better way to spend my time. 00:15:44:03 00:15:45:09 It's probably the honest answer, 00:15:45:10 00:15:46:19 right? I really enjoy finding 00:15:50:24 00:15:52:24 ways to bring new life 00:15:53:06 00:15:54:23 to fabric and textiles. 00:15:55:12 00:15:56:19 Another artist I really admire is 00:15:56:20 00:15:58:19 Tijay Mohammed, who 00:15:58:23 00:16:00:06 talks about the hopefulness 00:16:00:25 00:16:02:10 of discarded objects. 00:16:02:19 00:16:03:18 And I just love that. 00:16:03:19 00:16:05:01 I think he thinks of it in terms 00:16:05:02 00:16:06:19 mostly of people who get overlooked 00:16:06:21 00:16:07:24 in the margins of society, 00:16:09:03 00:16:10:02 which is definitely something on my 00:16:10:03 00:16:11:22 mind. But I think you can also think 00:16:11:23 00:16:13:10 of it on a more tangible level, 00:16:13:21 00:16:14:21 which is just... I 00:16:16:02 00:16:17:02 see here 00:16:17:24 00:16:19:02 in Brooklyn especially, I just see, 00:16:19:03 00:16:20:06 like clothes thrown out in the 00:16:20:07 00:16:22:13 street like they're trash, and 00:16:23:16 00:16:25:05 if we were just to wind the clock 00:16:25:06 00:16:26:23 back one hundred, one hundred fifty 00:16:26:24 00:16:28:11 years, cloth is one of the most 00:16:28:21 00:16:30:00 valuable things a person 00:16:30:17 00:16:32:02 could have because it took so much 00:16:32:03 00:16:33:03 labor to make that cloth. 00:16:33:08 00:16:34:11 So to see it just so... 00:16:34:14 00:16:35:14 produced 00:16:36:23 00:16:38:06 in such a mass fashion and then just 00:16:38:07 00:16:39:09 so easily discarded, something 00:16:39:10 00:16:40:22 that's just really bothersome to me 00:16:41:18 00:16:43:01 on a personal level. So I love, I 00:16:43:02 00:16:44:10 find a lot of gratification in 00:16:45:10 00:16:46:23 giving new life and giving them 00:16:47:09 00:16:48:12 a little something they didn't have 00:16:48:16 00:16:50:02 in their initial incarnation. 00:16:51:06 00:16:53:06 So that's 00:16:53:09 00:16:54:17 that's that's a lot of my starting 00:16:54:18 00:16:56:03 points for my work now is the 00:16:56:05 00:16:57:05 fabrics themselves, 00:16:58:06 00:16:59:24 what I run across, what I find. 00:17:00:07 00:17:01:07 I love... Lately 00:17:03:05 00:17:04:12 I've been making a few memorial 00:17:04:13 00:17:05:15 quilts, memory quilts. 00:17:06:11 00:17:08:06 I love thinking about 00:17:08:18 00:17:10:09 the person that's being honored in 00:17:10:15 00:17:11:24 this, especially with their clothing 00:17:12:00 00:17:12:19 and what that means. 00:17:12:20 00:17:14:00 Whether I knew the person or not. 00:17:14:08 00:17:15:09 I like to believe that 00:17:16:17 00:17:17:23 you can tell something from 00:17:17:24 00:17:18:24 somebody's clothes. 00:17:19:01 00:17:20:02 You know, even if you didn't know 00:17:20:03 00:17:21:13 them, like if you found the shirt 00:17:22:01 00:17:23:05 that I'm wearing now, a little patch 00:17:23:06 00:17:24:21 on the elbow, you're like, " ; oh, 00:17:25:04 00:17:26:13 he never, like, pushed the sleeves 00:17:26:14 00:17:28:12 up all the way. He's leaning 00:17:28:13 00:17:29:13 on it and got..." ; . 00:17:29:18 00:17:31:04 Or I just was recently 00:17:32:03 00:17:33:10 deconstructing a shirt that somebody 00:17:33:11 00:17:35:02 gave me and there was, in the front 00:17:35:03 00:17:36:11 shirt pocket, there's like a bunch 00:17:36:12 00:17:37:11 of little like, mm, 00:17:38:19 00:17:41:00 like little pieces of like soil 00:17:41:01 00:17:42:10 and leaf matter and things like 00:17:42:11 00:17:43:09 that, like they put something 00:17:43:10 00:17:44:09 natural in their pocket, someone. 00:17:44:10 00:17:46:09 I like to imagine 00:17:46:10 00:17:47:16 this person walking through the 00:17:47:17 00:17:49:08 woods or something like that. 00:17:49:18 00:17:51:14 But I like 00:17:52:03 00:17:53:11 starting with that point of 00:17:53:17 00:17:55:02 inspiration, the fabric being the 00:17:55:03 00:17:56:11 point of inspiration and going from 00:17:56:12 00:17:57:11 there. 00:17:59:16 00:18:02:02 And it's important 00:18:02:03 00:18:03:19 to me to 00:18:03:24 00:18:05:08 remain open and sensitive to 00:18:05:21 00:18:06:21 that process. 00:18:07:02 00:18:08:05 I, like a lot of improv 00:18:08:23 00:18:10:02 quilters, rarely have an 00:18:10:22 00:18:13:00 idea of where the project's going 00:18:13:01 00:18:14:00 when I start. 00:18:15:03 00:18:16:24 And quilting has taught me. 00:18:16:25 00:18:18:06 I'm so thankful for this lesson 00:18:18:07 00:18:19:09 because qolton has taught me 00:18:20:13 00:18:22:03 that sensitivity is a virtue. 00:18:22:19 00:18:24:14 I think for a long time I gave 00:18:24:17 00:18:26:22 myself a hard time for 00:18:27:01 00:18:28:09 being too sensitive to loud 00:18:29:05 00:18:31:15 noises and strong smells 00:18:31:16 00:18:33:12 and lots of people in a room, 00:18:33:18 00:18:34:12 that kind of thing. 00:18:34:13 00:18:35:12 Sure. 00:18:35:17 00:18:37:17 But now I realize that 00:18:38:01 00:18:39:18 the other side of that same coin is 00:18:40:01 00:18:41:21 when I look at my design wall and I 00:18:41:22 00:18:43:07 can see, OK, here's some fabric and 00:18:43:08 00:18:44:08 here's some fabric. 00:18:44:09 00:18:45:21 But what's the difference if I do 00:18:45:22 00:18:47:18 this right and if that 00:18:47:22 00:18:48:23 is what Ann Truitt calls it a " ; just 00:18:49:07 00:18:50:07 noticeable difference" ; . 00:18:50:16 00:18:52:02 Right? Like there is a difference 00:18:52:03 00:18:53:09 there. Right? And what is it? 00:18:53:10 00:18:54:19 And it's that sensitivity that 00:18:54:20 00:18:56:01 sometimes is not my best friend, but 00:18:56:02 00:18:57:23 sometimes it's my best friend that 00:18:57:24 00:18:59:04 helped me see the difference. 00:18:59:05 00:19:01:15 And so quilting has helped me 00:19:01:23 00:19:03:24 accept that about myself as a person 00:19:04:15 00:19:06:09 and also realize that that's a 00:19:06:10 00:19:08:03 virtue and a strength that I have as 00:19:08:05 00:19:09:05 an artist. 00:19:09:06 00:19:10:19 And so I'm very thankful for that. 00:19:10:20 00:19:12:15 So being open 00:19:12:16 00:19:14:01 to the process, starting with 00:19:14:12 00:19:16:01 some fabric that has meaning and 00:19:16:11 00:19:17:18 has some kind of substance in life 00:19:17:19 00:19:19:20 of its own, being open to that, 00:19:20:09 00:19:21:13 influencing the process, 00:19:23:01 00:19:24:13 I would say informs almost all 00:19:24:24 00:19:26:00 the pieces I make now. 00:19:27:07 00:19:29:04 That's a fantastic answer, 00:19:30:19 00:19:31:25 so I'm going to... I'm skipping 00:19:31:26 00:19:33:25 ahead slightly: we typically ask 00:19:34:00 00:19:36:03 folks to bring a touchstone quilt 00:19:36:08 00:19:37:22 or sometimes it's more than one. 00:19:38:00 00:19:39:00 Do 00:19:39:24 00:19:41:09 you want to share one quilt? 00:19:41:10 00:19:43:04 Do you feel like you is a touchstone 00:19:43:10 00:19:45:05 for your says something about your 00:19:45:06 00:19:46:01 your work? 00:19:46:02 00:19:47:02 Yeah, sure. 00:19:48:14 00:19:49:14 Let's start with this one. 00:19:49:16 00:19:50:16 Oh, perfect. 00:19:50:21 00:19:52:04 This is not... I'm just going to say 00:19:52:05 00:19:53:05 this is not the most 00:19:54:04 00:19:55:07 beautiful quilt I've ever made, but 00:19:55:08 00:19:56:11 it's important for a reason because 00:19:56:12 00:19:57:11 I can tell you a story about it. 00:19:57:12 00:19:58:16 Oh, those are the best ones. 00:19:58:19 00:19:59:19 So 00:20:02:15 00:20:03:19 you can edit all this part out, I'm 00:20:03:20 00:20:04:17 sure. Right. 00:20:04:18 00:20:05:17 Sure. 00:20:05:22 00:20:07:10 Even though this is the hanging 00:20:07:11 00:20:09:15 process is equally fascinating 00:20:09:16 00:20:10:13 to me. 00:20:10:14 00:20:11:10 Well, yeah. 00:20:11:11 00:20:12:12 Folks want to see all kinds of 00:20:12:13 00:20:13:12 stuff. Yeah. 00:20:14:20 00:20:16:05 All right. How's that look to you. 00:20:16:11 00:20:17:08 That's great. 00:20:17:09 00:20:18:08 Pretty good? OK, yeah. 00:20:18:14 00:20:20:13 So this 00:20:20:14 00:20:22:02 is a quilt... 00:20:23:22 00:20:26:21 Four years ago, 2016, 00:20:29:08 00:20:30:16 like a lot of folks, like a 00:20:31:03 00:20:32:19 little over half the country, I was 00:20:33:13 00:20:35:07 really shocked at the way the 2016 00:20:35:08 00:20:36:07 election turned out. 00:20:38:09 00:20:40:01 The president and I just don't agree 00:20:40:02 00:20:41:01 on a lot of things. 00:20:41:08 00:20:43:07 And so after he won the Electoral 00:20:43:08 00:20:45:14 College in 2016, I 00:20:46:02 00:20:47:07 just felt like the rug had been 00:20:47:08 00:20:48:03 pulled out from under me, a little bit 00:20:48:04 00:20:49:03 lost at sea. 00:20:49:12 00:20:51:09 So I didn't sew for a long time, for 00:20:51:10 00:20:53:06 several months and 00:20:53:14 00:20:55:04 this is, what you see behind me is 00:20:55:05 00:20:56:23 the first full size quilt I made 00:20:56:24 00:20:58:02 after he was elected. 00:20:58:08 00:20:59:11 So I had my little time of 00:20:59:12 00:21:00:08 hibernation. 00:21:00:09 00:21:01:05 I was laying low. 00:21:01:06 00:21:02:06 I'm in the school. 00:21:02:23 00:21:04:16 And this was one of the quilts that 00:21:04:17 00:21:05:17 --I have a group of quilts, I 00:21:06:20 00:21:08:01 have an approach maybe that I call 00:21:08:02 00:21:09:18 " ; oracle quilting" ; because I either 00:21:11:12 00:21:12:12 intentionally start with the 00:21:12:13 00:21:14:03 question and I approach the fabric 00:21:14:12 00:21:16:15 with that, or sometimes 00:21:16:16 00:21:18:13 I just come and sit down, 00:21:18:14 00:21:19:20 and sew. And then something, some 00:21:19:21 00:21:21:07 kind of message comes through. 00:21:21:14 00:21:22:17 It's the latter one that happened 00:21:22:18 00:21:23:14 with this quilt, because I didn't 00:21:23:15 00:21:24:18 sit down with any design 00:21:25:18 00:21:26:20 in mind other than just like " ; I'm 00:21:26:21 00:21:28:00 going to sew some colors I like 00:21:28:01 00:21:28:22 together. 00:21:28:23 00:21:29:21 And that's going to make me a little 00:21:29:22 00:21:31:11 happier by the end of the day than I 00:21:31:12 00:21:32:18 was in the morning." ; And that was 00:21:32:19 00:21:33:18 that was my goal. 00:21:34:00 00:21:35:00 But I did that and 00:21:36:00 00:21:37:15 I made this quilt and then 00:21:38:09 00:21:40:02 I stepped back and looked at it on 00:21:40:03 00:21:41:02 my design wall. 00:21:42:08 00:21:43:21 And I mean, I don't think it's too 00:21:43:22 00:21:45:04 grandiose to say I had a vision of 00:21:45:05 00:21:46:18 the future when I when I saw it, 00:21:46:19 00:21:47:21 right? It was 00:21:48:25 00:21:50:21 this idea that even 00:21:50:22 00:21:51:21 though we can't see 00:21:52:22 00:21:54:15 our way clear into the future, it's 00:21:54:16 00:21:55:13 still there. 00:21:55:14 00:21:56:20 Right? And the future can still be 00:21:56:21 00:21:58:15 bright. And so in my mind, 00:21:58:16 00:21:59:13 what I saw when I look at this 00:21:59:14 00:22:00:24 quilt, where all these orange 00:22:01:00 00:22:02:13 squares like sunlight pouring in 00:22:02:14 00:22:03:14 through a window so 00:22:04:13 00:22:05:24 that all we have to do 00:22:06:11 00:22:08:01 when we need that access to that new 00:22:08:02 00:22:09:22 future is just 1), give it 00:22:09:23 00:22:11:04 time, the time as a magic 00:22:11:05 00:22:12:01 ingredient. 00:22:12:02 00:22:13:12 And then, 2), we just got to step 00:22:13:13 00:22:14:09 into it. Right? 00:22:14:10 00:22:15:10 And so every time I look at this 00:22:15:11 00:22:16:10 quilt, I see the 00:22:17:07 00:22:18:07 presence of 00:22:19:16 00:22:21:21 something better, 00:22:21:22 00:22:23:09 more ideal than what we have now. 00:22:23:18 00:22:25:05 That might not be immediately 00:22:25:23 00:22:27:21 sensible, detectable, 00:22:27:25 00:22:28:22 but it is there. 00:22:28:23 00:22:30:10 And so I think that I look at this 00:22:30:11 00:22:32:08 quilt and it brings me some 00:22:32:09 00:22:33:04 comfort. 00:22:33:05 00:22:35:01 Yeah, that's... It's 00:22:35:02 00:22:35:21 really timely. 00:22:35:22 00:22:37:10 I'll say that we are recording this 00:22:37:11 00:22:39:13 on the day when we are awaiting news 00:22:39:14 00:22:41:11 of of the 2020 election. 00:22:41:23 00:22:43:06 So certainly this notion of the 00:22:43:07 00:22:45:05 future and 00:22:45:06 00:22:46:21 unknown is weighing heavily on my 00:22:46:23 00:22:47:23 mind, at least. 00:22:48:05 00:22:49:20 So I think it's safe to say for a 00:22:50:00 00:22:50:18 lot of us. 00:22:50:19 00:22:51:21 Exactly. Yeah. 00:22:52:04 00:22:53:16 So you mentioned that this quilt was 00:22:53:17 00:22:54:16 a comfort. 00:22:54:25 00:22:56:18 Have you used, quiltmaking in the 00:22:56:19 00:22:58:05 past to get through other difficult 00:22:58:06 00:22:59:05 times? 00:23:00:06 00:23:01:15 Yeah, let's go back one. 00:23:01:19 00:23:02:19 Let me put it... 00:23:03:01 00:23:03:23 Perfect. All right. We're jumping all 00:23:03:24 00:23:04:19 over. 00:23:04:20 00:23:05:23 OK, so 00:23:07:07 00:23:08:07 this quilt 00:23:09:07 00:23:11:08 I, like I mentioned, didn't sew much 00:23:11:09 00:23:12:25 at all when when the president was 00:23:12:26 00:23:14:00 first elected in 2016. 00:23:14:12 00:23:16:12 But I could bring myself to 00:23:17:01 00:23:18:03 sew small projects and 00:23:18:23 00:23:19:23 I remember, 00:23:21:03 00:23:22:17 it was January 2017. 00:23:24:14 00:23:26:06 I had read this beautiful essay by 00:23:26:12 00:23:27:12 Barbara Kingsolver. 00:23:27:13 00:23:28:13 I love her. 00:23:29:10 00:23:31:05 And she had written this one back in 00:23:31:16 00:23:33:16 the 90's when Bush won. 00:23:35:04 00:23:36:21 And she was talking about how 00:23:37:00 00:23:39:01 the flag is so often 00:23:39:10 00:23:40:15 viewed or associated with 00:23:41:10 00:23:42:24 one political party, viewed with 00:23:43:08 00:23:44:19 Republicans, with conservatives, 00:23:45:05 00:23:47:06 when in reality both parties 00:23:47:07 00:23:48:16 have patriots, both parties have 00:23:48:17 00:23:49:23 Americans. Both parties have people 00:23:49:24 00:23:50:24 who are loyal to the country. 00:23:51:03 00:23:52:10 And so she was making the argument 00:23:52:11 00:23:53:11 that Democrats 00:23:54:06 00:23:56:13 on the left need to reclaim the flag 00:23:56:14 00:23:58:09 as one of their symbols as 00:23:58:10 00:24:00:09 well. And so my 00:24:00:19 00:24:02:11 response to reading that essay was 00:24:02:13 00:24:04:15 to get on an online 00:24:04:21 00:24:06:11 merchandise retailer whose name I 00:24:06:12 00:24:07:11 won't say on this... 00:24:08:01 00:24:09:15 And order this flag, 00:24:10:14 00:24:11:18 just 100% polyester made 00:24:12:11 00:24:13:19 in China. And I'm like, 00:24:14:07 00:24:15:23 I was just about to click a button 00:24:16:08 00:24:17:20 when I was like, " ; Zak, what are 00:24:18:06 00:24:19:02 you doing? 00:24:19:03 00:24:20:09 You know how to sew." ; It's like I'd 00:24:20:10 00:24:22:01 forgotten because I hadn't even 00:24:22:06 00:24:23:06 made that other quilt that I'm 00:24:23:16 00:24:24:16 showed you a second ago. 00:24:24:18 00:24:25:21 I hadn't done anything in months. 00:24:25:22 00:24:27:10 And so I sat down and I made this 00:24:27:11 00:24:28:14 flag right here. 00:24:30:15 00:24:32:13 From there, I 00:24:32:14 00:24:33:13 started having 00:24:34:10 00:24:35:10 these responses 00:24:36:10 00:24:37:23 to the fire of the day, you know, 00:24:37:24 00:24:40:02 whatever news item there was, 00:24:41:02 00:24:42:18 I would just, I would process it by 00:24:42:19 00:24:43:18 making patches here. 00:24:43:21 00:24:45:13 So you can see here Elizabeth Warren 00:24:45:14 00:24:47:25 standing her ground, persisting. 00:24:48:14 00:24:50:18 This came from an uncle of mine. 00:24:51:12 00:24:52:23 A great American takes all of us. 00:24:52:24 00:24:54:03 You know something... So many 00:24:54:04 00:24:54:24 things, so many memories. 00:24:55:00 00:24:56:02 It's kind of like to me, 00:24:56:21 00:24:58:12 a quilty newspaper or a 00:24:58:21 00:24:59:17 quilted photo album. 00:24:59:18 00:25:00:22 Yeah, kind of time capsule. 00:25:00:23 00:25:01:22 A little bit. Yeah. 00:25:01:23 00:25:03:21 And so I stopped at 00:25:05:02 00:25:06:04 the first hundred days. 00:25:06:12 00:25:07:22 And so I took all the pieces I made 00:25:07:23 00:25:09:12 after the first hundred days of his 00:25:09:13 00:25:11:05 presidency and put them together in 00:25:11:07 00:25:12:21 this " ; O America" ; quilt 00:25:13:23 00:25:14:23 as a way of just saying, 00:25:16:03 00:25:17:08 " ; come on folks we can do 00:25:17:25 00:25:20:01 it. We just got to do it together." ; . 00:25:20:06 00:25:22:01 Yeah. Yeah, that's 00:25:22:14 00:25:23:04 it. 00:25:23:05 00:25:24:18 And this is my favorite part. 00:25:24:19 00:25:26:13 So this flag, I knew I wanted to 00:25:26:14 00:25:27:14 use it. 00:25:27:21 00:25:29:03 I love this flag. 00:25:29:06 00:25:30:08 It's got a lot of good mojo now 00:25:30:09 00:25:31:17 because I've used it so often. I've 00:25:31:18 00:25:33:00 taken it to protest and rallies and 00:25:33:01 00:25:34:01 marches, all kinds of stuff. 00:25:34:03 00:25:35:13 So I don't want to permanently 00:25:35:14 00:25:37:01 incorporate it. So it is safety 00:25:37:03 00:25:38:03 pinned 00:25:39:17 00:25:42:07 and there's this panel underneath 00:25:42:13 00:25:44:10 that holds that space. 00:25:44:11 00:25:45:00 I love that. 00:25:45:01 00:25:46:00 Right? 00:25:46:01 00:25:47:16 Yeah. It's got a designated place 00:25:47:25 00:25:48:23 to come back to. 00:25:48:24 00:25:50:20 And also still the message that the 00:25:50:22 00:25:52:10 flags out there doing its work. 00:25:52:24 00:25:53:19 Doing it's work. 00:25:53:20 00:25:54:25 Yeah, exactly. 00:25:55:10 00:25:56:10 It's great. 00:25:56:23 00:25:58:24 So this is a fairly large quilt. 00:25:59:10 00:26:01:07 I don't know how far past the frame 00:26:01:08 00:26:02:11 it extends, and you live 00:26:03:04 00:26:04:02 in Brooklyn. 00:26:04:03 00:26:04:25 A little bit up, a little bit down. 00:26:05:00 00:26:06:19 OK, maybe you live in a small space. 00:26:07:03 00:26:08:12 I'm going to I'm going to leap to 00:26:08:13 00:26:09:12 assume, where... 00:26:10:08 00:26:11:22 Can you describe the place where you 00:26:11:23 00:26:13:04 make or your studio? 00:26:13:24 00:26:14:24 Yeah. So I call 00:26:15:23 00:26:18:06 it my studio, but in reality 00:26:18:07 00:26:19:08 if you read between the lines, it's 00:26:19:09 00:26:20:09 just my eat-in kitchen. 00:26:21:15 00:26:23:01 I'm looking at it now, I would show 00:26:23:02 00:26:24:17 you, but it's a disaster because I'm 00:26:24:21 00:26:25:22 in the middle of like five, 00:26:25:23 00:26:26:22 different projects right now. 00:26:27:04 00:26:28:16 But one of the reasons we moved 00:26:29:02 00:26:30:09 into this particular apartment is I 00:26:30:10 00:26:32:01 have a very generous partner who 00:26:32:02 00:26:33:02 says, OK, this partner, 00:26:33:24 00:26:35:08 this, this apartment has 00:26:35:20 00:26:37:05 an eat-in kitchen. That'll be a good 00:26:37:06 00:26:38:07 space for you to work. 00:26:39:13 00:26:40:13 Because it's just a one bedroom. 00:26:40:14 00:26:41:13 We really got great. 00:26:42:04 00:26:44:08 And so in that space is 00:26:44:13 00:26:46:04 my cutting slash ironing table and 00:26:46:10 00:26:47:10 my little sewing table. 00:26:47:11 00:26:48:24 And on the back wall, I finally got 00:26:49:00 00:26:50:18 the design wall that people love to 00:26:50:19 00:26:51:18 have. 00:26:52:09 00:26:54:03 And having a design wall does make a 00:26:54:04 00:26:55:08 difference. Right? Like, there is a 00:26:55:09 00:26:56:13 beautiful thing about being able to 00:26:56:14 00:26:58:09 step back twenty feet 00:26:58:10 00:27:00:03 and just see everything 00:27:00:14 00:27:01:04 smaller. 00:27:01:05 00:27:02:04 Sure, yeah. 00:27:03:05 00:27:04:20 So it was helpful for me to have. 00:27:06:13 00:27:07:19 I'm constantly trying not 00:27:08:11 00:27:10:03 to accumulate materials, 00:27:10:10 00:27:12:02 but it's hard because everything I 00:27:12:04 00:27:13:18 see I want to salvage and give new 00:27:13:19 00:27:15:19 life to whether that's fabric, 00:27:15:20 00:27:17:05 or I'm also into natural dyeing. 00:27:17:06 00:27:18:17 And so I have a lot of flowers 00:27:19:10 00:27:20:11 and barks and 00:27:21:06 00:27:22:06 things in there sittin around. But 00:27:25:09 00:27:26:19 I try my best stay on top of the 00:27:26:20 00:27:28:06 mess and try not to be a hoarder. 00:27:28:18 00:27:30:05 And then when it gets too much 00:27:30:17 00:27:32:08 I just start passing it along. 00:27:32:10 00:27:33:19 You know, or trying to, at least. 00:27:34:11 00:27:36:08 Yeah, that's a it's a tricky balance 00:27:36:09 00:27:38:07 between sort of hoarding and 00:27:39:06 00:27:41:09 collecting what seems useful. 00:27:41:10 00:27:42:09 And I think when you have an 00:27:42:10 00:27:43:18 interest in -- I have a real 00:27:43:24 00:27:45:15 interest in 'stuff ; which I think 00:27:45:22 00:27:47:23 people think is maybe 00:27:47:24 00:27:48:24 a little consumerism-y. 00:27:49:20 00:27:51:06 But I really just think that objects 00:27:51:07 00:27:52:07 have such delightful... It's 00:27:53:08 00:27:54:23 hard, it's hard to walk that line 00:27:54:24 00:27:56:21 between accumulation 00:27:56:22 00:27:57:21 and use. 00:27:58:16 00:27:59:19 Definitely, for sure. 00:28:00:19 00:28:02:15 You know, one rule of thumb, that 00:28:02:17 00:28:04:09 I don't follow, my partner is 00:28:04:13 00:28:05:13 better at it than I am. 00:28:05:16 00:28:07:13 But he loves books and 00:28:07:15 00:28:09:07 so he tries to, if he brings a book 00:28:09:11 00:28:11:08 into the house, one goes 00:28:11:09 00:28:11:24 out the house,. 00:28:12:00 00:28:12:23 The one in, one out. 00:28:12:24 00:28:14:09 It's so good in theory. 00:28:14:10 00:28:14:19 I. 00:28:14:20 00:28:16:04 It's a great theory, yeah, we 00:28:16:16 00:28:17:21 should try it sometime maybe. 00:28:17:22 00:28:19:17 Yeah. I every every year. 00:28:19:18 00:28:21:09 I think this is going to be my one 00:28:21:10 00:28:23:01 in, one out year and it's usually 00:28:23:02 00:28:24:07 like five in, 00:28:24:22 00:28:26:25 sometimes something goes out, 00:28:26:26 00:28:27:04 you know. 00:28:27:14 00:28:29:05 Maybe, just maybe it's just easier 00:28:29:06 00:28:30:06 to move to a bigger space. 00:28:30:10 00:28:31:11 I think 00:28:32:06 00:28:33:24 the one in, one out is me moving out 00:28:34:00 00:28:36:00 of my house and moving into a larger 00:28:36:01 00:28:36:16 space there. 00:28:36:17 00:28:38:13 I'll can work on that. 00:28:38:14 00:28:39:13 So. 00:28:39:23 00:28:41:10 So, yeah, it sounds like you're, you 00:28:41:11 00:28:42:12 live with the work and 00:28:43:10 00:28:44:22 you kind of balance your space. 00:28:44:23 00:28:46:18 How how do you balance your time? 00:28:47:20 00:28:48:25 Oh, you know, it's tough with a full 00:28:48:26 00:28:50:23 time job. Yeah, it really is. 00:28:51:09 00:28:53:00 It's been a little bit easier in the 00:28:53:01 00:28:55:00 last several months because so 00:28:55:01 00:28:56:05 much of my time has been spent 00:28:56:06 00:28:57:20 working from home, doing remote 00:28:57:21 00:28:58:20 education. 00:28:59:11 00:29:00:18 So between classes, it's a lot 00:29:00:19 00:29:02:11 easier, just like whip out a quilt 00:29:02:12 00:29:03:11 and a little work done. 00:29:04:13 00:29:06:14 Here in New York we have gone back 00:29:06:15 00:29:07:13 and I'm one of the teachers who goes 00:29:07:14 00:29:08:18 back in the building every day. 00:29:09:00 00:29:11:00 So that fun time 00:29:11:01 00:29:12:11 came to an end, unfortunately. 00:29:13:21 00:29:14:21 So I, I try 00:29:15:17 00:29:17:04 my best. And that usually looks 00:29:17:06 00:29:19:02 like, in the evenings I get about 00:29:19:03 00:29:20:17 a half hour to an hour of time to 00:29:20:18 00:29:21:18 work. 00:29:22:13 00:29:23:20 Usually on the weekends I get to 00:29:23:21 00:29:25:07 devote one whole day, usually it's 00:29:25:08 00:29:26:14 Sunday to sewing projects, 00:29:27:12 00:29:28:16 to really make some good headway. 00:29:29:01 00:29:30:16 And I try to get to a point where 00:29:30:25 00:29:32:10 throughout the rest of the week I 00:29:32:11 00:29:33:21 can just do like the production 00:29:33:22 00:29:34:19 aspect. 00:29:34:20 00:29:36:08 So like Sunday it tends to be my 00:29:36:19 00:29:38:13 big creative, big vision day. 00:29:39:03 00:29:40:14 I make a plan for the week so 00:29:41:02 00:29:42:24 that on Monday through Friday I 00:29:43:01 00:29:44:10 just sit there and crank out a 00:29:44:11 00:29:45:14 little piece I need for the 00:29:45:15 00:29:46:21 following Sunday when I go back to 00:29:47:01 00:29:48:01 the bigger steps again. 00:29:49:09 00:29:50:24 Do you do you feel like your life 00:29:51:05 00:29:52:12 as a teacher, and your life as a 00:29:52:13 00:29:54:08 quiltmaker, intersect in 00:29:54:09 00:29:55:20 any way, either in sort of the 00:29:56:06 00:29:58:01 skills you use or like 00:29:58:02 00:29:59:03 do your students know about your 00:29:59:04 00:30:00:03 quilts? 00:30:00:17 00:30:01:17 My students do know about my quilts 00:30:02:13 00:30:03:20 because I take them in from time to 00:30:03:21 00:30:04:20 time to show them. Do 00:30:07:12 00:30:08:15 they intersect? 00:30:10:09 00:30:11:14 It's fine if they don't, I'm just 00:30:11:15 00:30:12:09 curious. 00:30:12:10 00:30:14:01 You know, but let's see if we can 00:30:14:02 00:30:15:09 find a way where the Venn diagram 00:30:15:10 00:30:16:13 overlaps, I do think... 00:30:16:18 00:30:17:18 In 00:30:18:17 00:30:19:25 the sense that my quilts are 00:30:20:00 00:30:21:00 often... 00:30:23:03 00:30:25:01 Contain a message, 00:30:25:02 00:30:26:16 they teach in that sense, right, 00:30:26:19 00:30:27:24 they carry some kind of meaning. 00:30:28:24 00:30:30:07 I think there's something there that 00:30:30:08 00:30:32:05 we could we could hang our hats 00:30:32:06 00:30:33:05 on. 00:30:34:22 00:30:36:20 I also think that quilting 00:30:37:05 00:30:38:05 has.. I'm 00:30:40:07 00:30:41:07 also into fermentation. 00:30:43:03 00:30:44:25 So quilting and fermentation both 00:30:45:04 00:30:46:19 have shown me that time is a magic 00:30:46:20 00:30:47:25 ingredient. Like I said a moment 00:30:47:26 00:30:49:03 ago, that things happen 00:30:49:24 00:30:51:19 that can only happen if given time. 00:30:52:22 00:30:54:10 And I think teaching would also fall 00:30:54:11 00:30:56:08 in that category. Like you can't 00:30:56:14 00:30:58:09 force a human, 00:30:58:14 00:30:59:21 a student in your class to 00:31:00:13 00:31:02:04 perform well on a certain day, no 00:31:02:10 00:31:03:23 matter how how well you set them up 00:31:03:24 00:31:04:23 for success. 00:31:04:24 00:31:06:10 But one hopes that over the course 00:31:06:11 00:31:07:11 of your time together, your course 00:31:07:12 00:31:09:03 of nine months together, that you 00:31:09:04 00:31:10:24 can move them from here to here. 00:31:12:22 00:31:14:06 We're patient. We do our best. 00:31:14:07 00:31:15:03 We wait and see. 00:31:15:04 00:31:16:21 Yeah, I think that's a great, that's 00:31:17:14 00:31:18:22 those are great places for the Venn 00:31:18:23 00:31:20:13 diagram to overlap for sure. 00:31:22:06 00:31:23:01 Let's see. 00:31:23:02 00:31:24:18 I have so many questions I want to 00:31:24:19 00:31:25:19 ask. 00:31:26:24 00:31:28:04 Do you... 00:31:28:05 00:31:29:04 I'm curious 00:31:30:01 00:31:32:01 if you feel like you work 00:31:32:02 00:31:33:14 in a in a community of quilters. 00:31:33:15 00:31:34:21 I mean, I think I first found out 00:31:34:22 00:31:36:12 about your work as part of the 00:31:37:15 00:31:38:10 43 for 43 project, which is a 00:31:38:11 00:31:39:10 community project. 00:31:41:05 00:31:42:24 Do you feel like you are working in 00:31:42:25 00:31:45:02 a community and do you do you enjoy 00:31:45:03 00:31:47:02 that, any kind of collaborative work 00:31:47:17 00:31:49:15 or or do you take sort of a head 00:31:49:16 00:31:51:18 down solo approach? 00:31:51:19 00:31:52:22 Is this where you feel more 00:31:52:23 00:31:53:22 comfortable? 00:31:58:14 00:31:59:19 You know, it's one foot in and one 00:31:59:20 00:32:00:22 foot out, like it feels 00:32:01:19 00:32:03:15 like, for folks who know the areas, 00:32:03:16 00:32:04:21 like when you go to Carowinds in 00:32:04:22 00:32:06:00 North Carolina, South Carolina, you 00:32:06:01 00:32:07:03 get to straddle the state line. 00:32:07:12 00:32:08:16 You know, left foot in North 00:32:08:17 00:32:09:17 Carolina, right foot in South 00:32:09:18 00:32:10:17 Carolina. I 00:32:15:02 00:32:16:13 value strongly community, and 00:32:17:10 00:32:19:00 I think at this point in my life, 00:32:19:05 00:32:20:17 most of that is through social 00:32:21:04 00:32:22:04 media. 00:32:23:21 00:32:25:08 Which can also be a challenging 00:32:25:10 00:32:26:17 thing for me at times, I mean, those 00:32:26:18 00:32:27:18 who follow me online will know that 00:32:27:19 00:32:29:12 I post something, sometimes I'll get 00:32:29:16 00:32:30:20 on like a daily kick and sometimes I 00:32:30:21 00:32:32:14 don't post for a couple of weeks or 00:32:32:15 00:32:33:20 a couple of months if we're honest. 00:32:34:12 00:32:35:12 And it 00:32:36:08 00:32:38:07 can be tough because there are times 00:32:38:08 00:32:40:05 when when I'm 00:32:40:06 00:32:41:22 in my darker days and I'm 00:32:42:01 00:32:43:08 scrolling through Instagram like 00:32:43:09 00:32:45:07 " ; how people are doing such 00:32:45:08 00:32:47:05 good work and I am wasting my life" ; , 00:32:47:07 00:32:49:02 you know, that 00:32:49:03 00:32:50:03 goes through the noggin. 00:32:50:24 00:32:52:09 And I never want to I never want my 00:32:52:10 00:32:53:14 work to be that for somebody else. 00:32:53:15 00:32:55:12 So I'm like " ; ahh, no more social 00:32:55:13 00:32:56:13 media!" ; . 00:32:56:22 00:32:58:12 But then I start missing my friends 00:32:58:13 00:32:59:08 and I want to see what people are 00:32:59:09 00:33:00:17 doing. So then I come back, you 00:33:00:18 00:33:02:10 know, so it's an ebb and flow thing. 00:33:04:16 00:33:07:00 I do like collaboration. 00:33:07:01 00:33:08:12 In fact, this quilt behind me, 00:33:09:14 00:33:10:18 Heidi Parkes, helped me, and Heidi 00:33:10:19 00:33:12:09 Parkse also interviewed with you all 00:33:12:10 00:33:13:09 at one point. 00:33:13:11 00:33:15:15 And she helped me do a lot 00:33:15:16 00:33:16:12 of this embroidery. 00:33:16:13 00:33:17:23 We kind of did like a crazy quilt 00:33:17:24 00:33:19:08 Americana type thing. 00:33:21:03 00:33:22:06 I'm working on a postal 00:33:23:11 00:33:24:19 collaboration right now with the 00:33:24:20 00:33:25:20 local textile artist 00:33:26:21 00:33:27:21 and we are 00:33:28:17 00:33:29:15 working on the square that we just 00:33:29:16 00:33:30:11 mailed back and forth. 00:33:30:12 00:33:31:21 And we just add a little section 00:33:32:12 00:33:33:13 and then when it gets too big for an envelope, we 00:33:33:24 00:33:34:24 just start over. 00:33:35:05 00:33:36:05 You know, 00:33:37:09 00:33:38:12 I would like to do more 00:33:38:14 00:33:40:07 collaborations because I love that. 00:33:40:13 00:33:41:22 The 43 for 43 project--just 00:33:43:06 00:33:44:17 a quick 10 seconds for folks who 00:33:44:18 00:33:46:13 don't know it, there were 00:33:46:16 00:33:48:03 forty three teaching students, 00:33:48:04 00:33:49:23 college students, in Mexico and in 00:33:52:09 00:33:53:19 2014, 2016, Minutes 00:33:55:13 00:33:57:04 that disappeared one night they were 00:33:57:05 00:33:58:04 booked and disappeared. 00:33:58:05 00:34:00:01 And so folks down to 00:34:00:02 00:34:01:09 Mexico for a long time been trying 00:34:01:10 00:34:02:18 to raise awareness about, hey, where 00:34:02:19 00:34:04:02 are these folks? We want them back. 00:34:04:03 00:34:04:23 You know, the government will tell 00:34:04:24 00:34:05:13 me that. 00:34:05:14 00:34:07:13 And so when I was down 00:34:07:14 00:34:09:05 there a few years ago, 00:34:09:23 00:34:12:02 I was just so struck and impressed 00:34:12:03 00:34:14:02 by how hard people were working 00:34:14:03 00:34:15:19 to make sure these people 00:34:16:02 00:34:17:15 were remembered and the justice was 00:34:17:16 00:34:18:15 found for them 00:34:19:16 00:34:20:16 that when I came back--and 00:34:22:22 00:34:24:19 I should say that I was struck 00:34:24:20 00:34:25:25 when I went down to Mexico on that 00:34:26:00 00:34:27:00 particular trip that, 00:34:28:07 00:34:29:19 when I learned what the number forty 00:34:29:20 00:34:30:20 three meant, because you saw '43' 00:34:30:23 00:34:32:04 everywhere, it was like graffiti on 00:34:32:05 00:34:33:04 walls and scratched on restaurant 00:34:33:09 00:34:34:09 tables. 00:34:34:13 00:34:35:18 When I realized what 43 meant, I 00:34:37:21 00:34:38:21 had this, this this 00:34:39:17 00:34:41:03 vague memory 00:34:41:15 00:34:43:12 of scrolling past a headline 00:34:43:21 00:34:45:08 on a screen months before 00:34:45:19 00:34:47:18 and not clicking, not reading, not 00:34:48:05 00:34:49:13 like--how can we? We can't read 00:34:49:14 00:34:50:18 about everything all the time. 00:34:51:01 00:34:51:25 Sure. 00:34:52:00 00:34:53:18 But I was like, dag, it's good to be 00:34:53:19 00:34:55:11 in the first world, it's good to be 00:34:55:16 00:34:56:11 in the United States. 00:34:56:12 00:34:58:03 It's good to be where, for the most 00:34:58:04 00:34:59:24 part, we hopefully feel safe 00:34:59:25 00:35:01:07 and comfortable, you know. 00:35:02:02 00:35:03:05 So all of that went to my mind. 00:35:03:06 00:35:04:21 I'm like, OK, so if I missed this 00:35:05:01 00:35:06:08 one, and I'm someone who's 00:35:06:10 00:35:07:21 interested in Mexico, Mexican 00:35:07:23 00:35:08:22 history, Mexican culture, Mexican 00:35:08:23 00:35:10:07 people. I'm sure other people missed 00:35:10:08 00:35:11:15 it, too. So I came back to the US 00:35:11:19 00:35:13:13 and organized this 43 for 43 00:35:13:16 00:35:15:01 project in which I rallied... 00:35:15:08 00:35:16:19 well it turned, out more than 00:35:17:06 00:35:18:10 forty three, because in the end I 00:35:18:11 00:35:19:13 think we had maybe sixty four 00:35:19:14 00:35:21:03 participants and everybody made a 00:35:21:08 00:35:23:03 square for one of 00:35:23:04 00:35:24:05 the boys that disappeared. 00:35:24:15 00:35:26:10 People embroidered their portraits 00:35:26:11 00:35:27:20 like Heidi embroidered a portrait 00:35:27:21 00:35:29:11 for one of the guys that everybody 00:35:29:15 00:35:30:23 put their names on there. 00:35:31:01 00:35:32:17 A lot of appliqué was done, and we 00:35:32:18 00:35:34:01 made it into a long quilted 00:35:34:24 00:35:35:24 protest banner. 00:35:36:08 00:35:37:18 But then I took to Mexico City with 00:35:37:19 00:35:39:05 me and with a 00:35:39:24 00:35:41:05 mediator, helped get it to the 00:35:41:06 00:35:42:05 families 00:35:44:03 00:35:45:09 for whatever purposes they need to 00:35:45:15 00:35:47:10 in the streets or to hang 00:35:47:17 00:35:48:17 somewhere. 00:35:49:20 00:35:51:09 So I love collaborative projects 00:35:51:22 00:35:53:15 like that because I do believe that 00:35:53:16 00:35:55:01 there are things that can only 00:35:55:02 00:35:57:00 happen when we're working together. 00:35:57:13 00:35:59:19 And I would like to find... 00:36:00:04 00:36:01:15 I got ideas. I mean I mean always 00:36:03:05 00:36:04:10 it's good to be me because I got 00:36:04:11 00:36:05:15 ideas, but the thing is, I just 00:36:05:16 00:36:07:06 don't have the time necessarily to 00:36:07:09 00:36:08:12 organize these things. 00:36:08:13 00:36:10:10 But I am hopeful 00:36:10:11 00:36:12:12 that one day I will because I really 00:36:12:13 00:36:14:05 enjoyed the role of organizer and I 00:36:14:10 00:36:16:01 enjoyed being the person that 00:36:16:10 00:36:17:18 literally pieced it all together 00:36:18:08 00:36:20:03 and thinking of ways 00:36:20:04 00:36:22:04 to raise awareness, and to use 00:36:22:20 00:36:24:04 my time and my talent in ways that 00:36:24:06 00:36:25:11 hopefully leaves us a little bit 00:36:25:12 00:36:26:23 better than it was 00:36:27:12 00:36:28:17 before I plopped down in nineteen 00:36:28:18 00:36:29:18 eighty. 00:36:30:07 00:36:31:20 That's, that's a great that's a 00:36:31:25 00:36:33:11 great answer and great I think 00:36:33:12 00:36:34:15 admirable goal. 00:36:35:21 00:36:37:18 You mentioned... I mean many of 00:36:37:19 00:36:39:14 your quilts have have messages. 00:36:40:02 00:36:41:17 Is there... Why do you think that 00:36:41:20 00:36:43:18 quilts are uniquely 00:36:43:19 00:36:45:05 suited or rather, do you think that 00:36:45:06 00:36:47:03 quilts are uniquely suited, for 00:36:47:16 00:36:48:20 carrying a message? 00:36:49:07 00:36:51:00 Yeah. Oh one hundred percent. 00:36:53:01 00:36:54:17 And I think it has to do with just 00:36:54:18 00:36:55:20 how domestic they are. 00:36:56:01 00:36:57:01 Right. 00:36:57:16 00:36:59:17 All forms of art, I think, have 00:37:00:05 00:37:02:05 something special or unique that 00:37:02:06 00:37:03:15 only they can do, right, that's why 00:37:03:16 00:37:04:15 they exist. 00:37:04:21 00:37:06:09 I would say one of the things that 00:37:06:10 00:37:07:23 only quilting can do 00:37:08:08 00:37:10:15 is take something so domestic, 00:37:10:18 00:37:12:10 something so accessible, something 00:37:12:20 00:37:14:01 that would otherwise perhaps be 00:37:14:02 00:37:15:12 wasted, thrown away in the garbage 00:37:15:13 00:37:16:14 by trash can 00:37:17:14 00:37:18:20 and turn into something else. 00:37:19:12 00:37:21:01 And especially if we're thinking 00:37:21:10 00:37:23:05 of some kind of community quilting, 00:37:24:02 00:37:25:13 activism, quilting, political 00:37:25:18 00:37:26:18 quilting. 00:37:27:25 00:37:29:08 There's ways to say 00:37:30:05 00:37:31:19 here, for example, here are some 00:37:31:24 00:37:33:21 things that really matter to me in 00:37:33:22 00:37:35:01 my heart of hearts. This is what I 00:37:35:02 00:37:36:09 carry around me on a daily basis. 00:37:36:21 00:37:37:21 So I'm going to reach into my 00:37:37:22 00:37:39:03 drawers. I'm going to take out my 00:37:39:04 00:37:40:13 clothes and cut them up, and 00:37:41:02 00:37:42:01 then I'm going to make something beautiful 00:37:42:02 00:37:43:01 to show you right in 00:37:43:24 00:37:44:24 a similar way. 00:37:45:23 00:37:47:13 In Latin America, there's a protest 00:37:47:14 00:37:49:08 tradition of the cacerolazo, 00:37:50:02 00:37:51:18 which is started often with women 00:37:51:23 00:37:53:02 and when it was time to 00:37:53:20 00:37:55:06 take the streets, protest, something 00:37:56:01 00:37:57:10 they didn't do a whole lot of 00:37:57:11 00:37:58:24 organizing and then like funding 00:37:59:00 00:38:00:01 super PACs and all this kind of 00:38:00:02 00:38:01:13 thing. They just went to the kitchen 00:38:01:14 00:38:03:02 drawer, pulled out a pot and a 00:38:03:03 00:38:04:11 wooden spoon and went to the street 00:38:04:12 00:38:06:00 banging. Right. Like it's taking 00:38:06:01 00:38:07:11 what's in our hearts, readily 00:38:07:19 00:38:09:15 accessible, democratic, 00:38:10:03 00:38:11:13 and taking it public and put it out 00:38:11:14 00:38:12:10 there in the community. 00:38:12:11 00:38:13:17 And so I think that's something that 00:38:14:01 00:38:16:06 makes quilting especially suited 00:38:16:12 00:38:17:12 for community 00:38:19:04 00:38:21:08 engagement, for the public forum, 00:38:23:05 00:38:24:07 and for sharing what's 00:38:25:01 00:38:26:17 on the inside with everyone on the 00:38:26:18 00:38:27:18 outside. 00:38:28:19 00:38:29:25 That's a great answer, I think. 00:38:30:00 00:38:31:12 Yeah, that's they have so many 00:38:31:13 00:38:33:02 things going for them and kind of 00:38:33:13 00:38:34:25 sometimes are a little unassuming, 00:38:35:00 00:38:36:06 which is really nice and sort of 00:38:36:07 00:38:38:04 soft, a soft way to get our 00:38:38:05 00:38:39:05 point across. 00:38:40:16 00:38:42:22 So I think someone who's an expert 00:38:42:23 00:38:44:19 at that is Kathryn Clark. 00:38:45:22 00:38:46:21 I don't know if folks are familiar 00:38:46:22 00:38:49:00 with her work, but she has a way 00:38:49:01 00:38:50:01 of taking, 00:38:51:16 00:38:52:16 like, she made... 00:38:54:23 00:38:55:23 (I'm blanking). 00:38:58:05 00:38:59:11 There... She made this quilt 00:38:59:18 00:39:01:18 recently about 00:39:02:09 00:39:03:09 inequities in rent 00:39:04:08 00:39:05:11 stabilization or apartments, 00:39:05:12 00:39:07:01 something like that, folks can look 00:39:07:02 00:39:08:14 her up, maybe you can edit this part 00:39:08:15 00:39:09:18 out, but folks can look 00:39:10:11 00:39:10:21 her up. 00:39:10:22 00:39:11:16 We'll share some photos. 00:39:11:17 00:39:13:06 Yeah, show us the photos, because 00:39:13:20 00:39:15:12 she has a way of taking these hard 00:39:15:16 00:39:17:05 truths and making them into 00:39:19:09 00:39:21:03 soft fabric, literally, and it makes 00:39:21:04 00:39:22:14 you want to say, " ; hey, what are all 00:39:22:15 00:39:23:24 these little squares representing, 00:39:24:25 00:39:25:20 what's going on here? What's the 00:39:25:21 00:39:26:19 story?" ; And you sit back and you 00:39:26:20 00:39:28:08 think like, " ; well, dang, was 00:39:28:13 00:39:29:16 tough..." ; You know? 00:39:30:16 00:39:31:18 She's an expert at that. 00:39:32:02 00:39:33:12 And I hate that I'm blanking on the 00:39:33:15 00:39:34:16 critical detail right now. 00:39:34:17 00:39:35:17 No, that's all right. 00:39:36:01 00:39:37:08 It'll come to me as soon as we click 00:39:37:09 00:39:38:09 " ; End meeting" ; . 00:39:39:08 00:39:40:08 It always happens. 00:39:41:22 00:39:43:12 So you've talked you talked about a 00:39:43:13 00:39:45:18 few names, Heidi Parkes and 00:39:46:06 00:39:48:02 Kathryn Clark and Irene 00:39:48:03 00:39:49:14 Williams. Is there other folks 00:39:50:08 00:39:51:12 or other sort of moments 00:39:52:09 00:39:53:11 or anything--it doesn't have to be 00:39:53:12 00:39:55:02 quilting related--that you're you're 00:39:55:03 00:39:56:23 really drawn to or have been 00:39:56:24 00:39:57:23 inspiring you lately? 00:39:59:14 00:40:00:25 Well, I would say I mean, the 00:40:01:12 00:40:02:25 answers that come first to mind are 00:40:02:26 00:40:04:24 Irene Williams are Heidi Parkes. 00:40:05:00 00:40:06:12 I think Heidi does a wonderful job 00:40:06:13 00:40:07:12 of turning the inside 00:40:08:08 00:40:09:22 out, you know, and using 00:40:10:07 00:40:12:03 her life and 00:40:12:04 00:40:13:19 her body in ways to 00:40:14:08 00:40:16:01 produce work that is very personal. 00:40:16:09 00:40:17:12 And I think that's something that 00:40:17:24 00:40:19:05 ,as artists, we should all strive 00:40:19:06 00:40:20:16 for, you know, like what's what's 00:40:20:17 00:40:22:14 the one thing that only I can 00:40:22:15 00:40:24:05 do and let me do that. 00:40:24:12 00:40:25:14 And I think I did a really great 00:40:25:15 00:40:26:15 model of that 00:40:28:03 00:40:29:11 Tijay Muhammad, I mentioned earlier 00:40:29:17 00:40:31:17 who makes wonderful, I 00:40:31:18 00:40:32:15 mean, he wouldn't consider himself a 00:40:32:16 00:40:34:02 quilter, but he does use a lot 00:40:34:12 00:40:35:13 of fabric. 00:40:35:14 00:40:37:01 And he recently made a bunch of 00:40:37:02 00:40:38:07 really lovely 00:40:38:23 00:40:40:16 textile portraits of people that are 00:40:40:17 00:40:41:16 close to him. 00:40:42:03 00:40:43:03 And he's from Ghana. 00:40:43:17 00:40:45:10 So he's working in this African 00:40:45:11 00:40:46:12 tradition, it's really 00:40:47:13 00:40:48:12 lovely. And he's the one that 00:40:48:13 00:40:49:23 mentioned the " ; hopefulness of 00:40:49:24 00:40:50:23 discarded objects" ; . 00:40:50:24 00:40:51:24 You know, I just love that. 00:40:57:23 00:41:00:05 And there's always writers, too, 00:41:00:12 00:41:01:22 you know, I love 00:41:02:24 00:41:04:16 like Emerson, for example, I was I'm 00:41:04:17 00:41:05:23 working on this piece for Feel Good 00:41:05:24 00:41:07:21 Fibers for their blog 00:41:07:22 00:41:08:22 about the 00:41:09:17 00:41:11:03 role that beauty plays in our 00:41:11:14 00:41:13:06 work. Like is enough just to make a 00:41:13:07 00:41:15:07 beautiful something or does it need 00:41:15:08 00:41:16:07 to have more meaning? 00:41:16:16 00:41:18:03 And I think the inspiration 00:41:18:17 00:41:20:06 for what got me thinking down that 00:41:20:07 00:41:21:14 line was Emerson, who wrote 00:41:22:03 00:41:23:07 this really beautiful poem 00:41:24:05 00:41:25:22 to the rhododendron, right? 00:41:26:05 00:41:26:25 He's walking through the woods of 00:41:27:00 00:41:28:08 Massachusetts, he sees this 00:41:28:16 00:41:30:12 rhododendron and he 00:41:30:13 00:41:31:19 says that " ; if 00:41:32:19 00:41:34:04 the sages come and ask you, like, 00:41:34:05 00:41:35:16 why do you exist, rhododendron? 00:41:36:05 00:41:38:09 All you have to say: is beauty 00:41:38:10 00:41:39:22 is not excuse for being" ; 00:41:40:18 00:41:42:09 Like beauty is enough, you know? 00:41:42:10 00:41:43:19 And so I feel like sometimes I'm 00:41:43:20 00:41:45:15 working and I'm like, OK, if 00:41:45:17 00:41:46:23 this particular project doesn't have 00:41:46:24 00:41:47:23 capital-M Meaning? 00:41:50:23 00:41:52:16 That's OK, Emerson gave me 00:41:52:17 00:41:53:23 permission to say, if it's 00:41:54:08 00:41:55:19 beautiful, that's enough. 00:41:56:18 00:41:58:15 And so I would lump Emerson in there 00:41:58:16 00:42:00:04 with Thoreau, definitely is one my a 00:42:00:05 00:42:01:03 huge influences. 00:42:01:04 00:42:01:22 I love it. 00:42:01:23 00:42:02:22 He's trying to see 00:42:04:01 00:42:05:07 through the shifting sands 00:42:05:22 00:42:07:01 of what was happening during the 00:42:07:02 00:42:08:16 eighteen hundreds and try to predict 00:42:08:22 00:42:10:03 where we're going and try to see 00:42:10:07 00:42:12:01 where we're where we're coming from. 00:42:13:16 00:42:14:20 I mentioned Barbara Kingsolver. 00:42:14:21 00:42:16:14 I love her nonfiction essays 00:42:17:09 00:42:18:18 and I love poetry too. 00:42:18:20 00:42:20:11 Right. I mean, who doesn't love like 00:42:20:12 00:42:22:03 Mary Oliver with her Wild Geese 00:42:22:04 00:42:23:03 poem? 00:42:25:16 00:42:27:07 I read a lot, but yeah, so there's 00:42:27:13 00:42:28:14 a few names folks want to.... 00:42:28:24 00:42:29:12 Yeah. 00:42:29:13 00:42:31:12 The glimpse of some of my input. 00:42:31:19 00:42:33:03 That's great. Yeah, I mean, it's 00:42:33:04 00:42:34:12 it's so interesting sometimes to 00:42:34:13 00:42:35:19 hear how people funnel all 00:42:36:09 00:42:38:05 their different parts of 00:42:38:06 00:42:40:07 their life in their brain and into 00:42:40:08 00:42:41:08 what they're thinking about. 00:42:42:13 00:42:44:11 So this next question is a doozy. 00:42:45:07 00:42:47:08 I'd love to ask it, but it's really, 00:42:47:16 00:42:48:16 it's a challenge. 00:42:49:10 00:42:51:03 But what do you think makes a great 00:42:51:09 00:42:52:09 quilt? 00:42:55:24 00:42:56:24 Hmm... I'm 00:43:00:21 00:43:01:21 going to say 00:43:02:19 00:43:03:19 that,you 00:43:06:01 00:43:07:04 know, quilt, art can be different 00:43:07:05 00:43:08:16 things, great quilts 00:43:10:04 00:43:11:09 can be great art and great quilts 00:43:11:10 00:43:13:10 can be great quilts, right? 00:43:13:22 00:43:14:20 Soit depends on how we want to 00:43:14:21 00:43:15:20 frame the question. 00:43:16:24 00:43:17:24 I think a great quilt is 00:43:19:15 00:43:21:01 anything that 00:43:22:01 00:43:23:12 is made with care and attention, 00:43:24:09 00:43:25:12 anything that 00:43:26:18 00:43:28:05 brings pleasure to the person making 00:43:28:06 00:43:29:16 it and pleasure to the person 00:43:29:17 00:43:30:16 receiving it. 00:43:31:02 00:43:32:19 I think if it meets that criteria, 00:43:32:21 00:43:34:18 then it's a great quilt right? 00:43:35:02 00:43:36:04 Now, if we want to frame it a little 00:43:36:05 00:43:37:09 bit larger, if we want to zoom out 00:43:37:10 00:43:38:09 or maybe zoomin' in, I don't know 00:43:38:10 00:43:39:13 what direction we're zoomin', but 00:43:40:12 00:43:41:23 I think about what makes good quilt 00:43:41:24 00:43:42:23 as art... Emerson 00:43:47:21 00:43:49:16 says beauty is enough and 00:43:49:18 00:43:51:09 I'm inclined to agree with that, but 00:43:51:10 00:43:52:22 I think the reason I'm drawn to 00:43:53:01 00:43:54:09 quilting is it is not just 00:43:54:10 00:43:56:03 beautiful. It also has utility, 00:43:56:16 00:43:58:01 but it also has a function. 00:43:58:08 00:43:59:12 It keeps us warm. 00:43:59:16 00:44:00:23 It tells stories. 00:44:02:06 00:44:04:05 It's a way to for us to live on 00:44:04:06 00:44:06:04 just a little bit, you know. 00:44:08:22 00:44:10:09 Anne Truitt, who is a sculptor 00:44:10:22 00:44:12:08 that some of our listeners may know 00:44:12:19 00:44:13:19 is known for her almost 00:44:15:10 00:44:17:07 human-size, five or six feet tall, 00:44:17:20 00:44:19:16 four-sided columns 00:44:19:17 00:44:21:11 made out of wood, and somebody was 00:44:21:12 00:44:22:17 asking, why do you work in wood? 00:44:22:23 00:44:24:18 She says, well, it has about the 00:44:24:19 00:44:26:03 same lifespan as human being. 00:44:27:23 00:44:29:10 And I think did the same thing 00:44:29:13 00:44:31:07 applies to fabric, right, that 00:44:31:12 00:44:32:24 we create these beautiful things 00:44:33:00 00:44:33:24 that 00:44:34:21 00:44:36:21 with with one hopes it's 00:44:36:22 00:44:37:22 used right, gets loved 00:44:39:08 00:44:40:23 and doesn't last that much longer 00:44:41:00 00:44:42:11 than we do, but it can last a little 00:44:42:12 00:44:43:11 bit. And I think, 00:44:47:01 00:44:49:10 that when I think of great 00:44:49:17 00:44:51:21 quilts, there's something 00:44:51:22 00:44:53:19 about the fact that they're 00:44:53:20 00:44:55:20 impermanent that also 00:44:56:03 00:44:57:05 comes into play. 00:44:57:22 00:44:59:01 They're fragile and they're delicate 00:44:59:02 00:45:00:01 things. 00:45:00:24 00:45:02:03 And because they're meant to be 00:45:02:04 00:45:03:19 used, they break down faster. 00:45:05:04 00:45:06:14 And I think there's something 00:45:07:09 00:45:08:20 in that natural decomposition 00:45:09:13 00:45:11:15 that is beautiful and something 00:45:11:16 00:45:12:15 to aspire towards, 00:45:14:11 00:45:15:17 so that's a good answer. 00:45:17:17 00:45:18:05 No, that's a great answer. 00:45:18:06 00:45:18:21 Off the top of my head. 00:45:18:22 00:45:21:09 No, it it's not an easy question. 00:45:21:18 00:45:22:23 And I always feel a little devious 00:45:23:07 00:45:24:09 for asking it, because I think it's 00:45:24:10 00:45:25:23 sort of honestly sort of a cruel 00:45:26:04 00:45:27:04 question. 00:45:27:22 00:45:29:12 But it always we always get great 00:45:29:19 00:45:31:13 answers. I mean, it's so fascinating 00:45:31:15 00:45:33:10 to hear people's variety of 00:45:33:11 00:45:35:03 notions of what that means and what 00:45:35:04 00:45:36:04 greatness means. 00:45:37:18 00:45:39:02 Where, where do most of the quilts 00:45:39:07 00:45:40:09 that you make end up? 00:45:40:15 00:45:42:11 Do you keep them or do you 00:45:42:12 00:45:43:13 sell them? Do you 00:45:44:08 00:45:45:08 and where what 00:45:46:06 00:45:48:04 is the dream for their future 00:45:48:10 00:45:50:03 that they that they do decompose or 00:45:50:04 00:45:51:17 that they're preserved forever? 00:45:54:22 00:45:56:18 Well, a you know, a quilter's got 00:45:56:19 00:45:58:04 to live so about have been 00:45:58:21 00:45:59:12 sold. 00:45:59:13 00:46:00:21 Sure, I think we sometimes people 00:46:00:22 00:46:01:20 are skittish about talking about 00:46:01:21 00:46:03:11 this, but it's a huge part of the 00:46:03:13 00:46:04:11 quilt-making world. 00:46:04:12 00:46:05:12 So, yeah. 00:46:05:23 00:46:07:09 So about half have been sold, 00:46:07:10 00:46:09:04 they're out there in the world, 00:46:09:20 00:46:11:07 doing their thing, living their 00:46:11:08 00:46:13:02 lives on people's beds, folded over 00:46:13:16 00:46:15:10 their banisters on walls or whatever 00:46:15:11 00:46:16:10 folks do with them. 00:46:17:15 00:46:19:11 The other half are folded up in 00:46:19:12 00:46:21:01 a big pile in my bedroom. 00:46:22:09 00:46:23:21 In our little tiny one bedroom 00:46:23:25 00:46:25:16 Brooklyn apartment, there is along 00:46:25:21 00:46:26:21 one wall a long 00:46:27:18 00:46:29:11 arm machine that I got several years 00:46:29:12 00:46:31:14 ago. If 00:46:31:15 00:46:32:18 you were to ask me what my least 00:46:32:19 00:46:34:03 favorite part of quilting is--don't 00:46:35:12 00:46:37:09 hate me for this--I don't like 00:46:37:10 00:46:38:09 to quilt, 00:46:40:12 00:46:40:25 like the actual quilting. 00:46:40:26 00:46:41:19 I'm with you! If I could, if I can 00:46:41:20 00:46:43:03 make a quilt and never quilt it, 00:46:43:19 00:46:45:18 that'll be great now, which I guess 00:46:45:19 00:46:46:19 is possible, you know. 00:46:46:23 00:46:48:00 And so that's why I got the long 00:46:48:01 00:46:48:22 arm, because I'm like, OK, that 00:46:48:23 00:46:50:08 makes the least 00:46:51:01 00:46:52:23 unsavory part of the process for me 00:46:52:24 00:46:53:22 a little bit easier. 00:46:53:23 00:46:55:19 And honestly, like all my quilts get 00:46:55:20 00:46:56:17 quilted the same way, unless I'm 00:46:56:18 00:46:58:05 hand-quilting them, if it's machine 00:46:58:06 00:46:59:12 quilting it's just parallel lines. 00:46:59:13 00:47:01:11 Because I just want to, I want 00:47:01:12 00:47:03:01 the quilting itself to disappear 00:47:03:10 00:47:04:13 and I want the forms and the colors 00:47:04:14 00:47:06:03 of the quilt top to come forward. 00:47:06:22 00:47:08:18 So, oh, you're asking where do 00:47:08:19 00:47:10:07 the quilts end up? So along 00:47:10:15 00:47:12:15 one bedroom, blocking the window 00:47:12:16 00:47:14:07 with our fire escape (probably not 00:47:14:11 00:47:16:11 safe) is the long arm machine. 00:47:16:18 00:47:18:10 And there's a stack of probably two 00:47:18:15 00:47:19:24 dozen quilts folded up there. 00:47:22:00 00:47:23:11 At some point in the future I 00:47:23:24 00:47:25:10 would love to have a space where I 00:47:25:11 00:47:26:22 can display them, hang them on 00:47:26:23 00:47:27:23 walls. 00:47:36:10 00:47:37:20 I think this is also a timely 00:47:37:22 00:47:38:21 question given the quilt you have 00:47:38:22 00:47:40:10 behind you, but people typically 00:47:40:23 00:47:42:10 refer to quilts as a uniquely 00:47:42:11 00:47:43:10 American art. 00:47:44:06 00:47:45:21 You can, we can we can, argue about 00:47:45:22 00:47:46:24 that until the cows come home. 00:47:46:25 00:47:48:05 But that's kind of the notion. 00:47:50:09 00:47:51:24 What do you think that is the 00:47:52:00 00:47:53:11 importance of quilts in American 00:47:53:12 00:47:54:12 life? 00:47:55:02 00:47:56:02 Do they... 00:47:56:09 00:47:57:16 That's, that's a that's a loaded 00:47:57:17 00:47:59:11 question, but if you want to talk a 00:47:59:12 00:48:00:11 little bit about that. 00:48:00:12 00:48:02:02 I do love, 00:48:02:23 00:48:04:16 and it kind of circles back to a 00:48:05:00 00:48:05:20 few moments ago. 00:48:05:21 00:48:07:10 But I do love that quilting is 00:48:10:13 00:48:11:22 not usually something that's done in 00:48:11:23 00:48:13:06 a studio, is not done in a separate 00:48:13:07 00:48:15:10 space. Usually it's done in people's 00:48:15:11 00:48:17:05 homes, it is 00:48:17:23 00:48:18:20 the heart. 00:48:18:21 00:48:20:14 I mean, when you think of the most 00:48:20:15 00:48:21:21 private place in your home, 00:48:23:03 00:48:24:17 I got two places, one is the toilet, 00:48:24:18 00:48:25:20 the other one for the bed, right? 00:48:26:07 00:48:27:23 Like, when you think of the most, 00:48:27:25 00:48:29:09 the heart of your home, 00:48:30:05 00:48:31:10 I would argue, is your bed. 00:48:31:11 00:48:32:22 And we're talking about making 00:48:32:23 00:48:34:24 things for that 00:48:35:00 00:48:35:24 space. 00:48:37:07 00:48:39:07 And so when 00:48:39:08 00:48:40:24 we choose to share that space with 00:48:41:05 00:48:43:01 the outside world, there's a 00:48:43:03 00:48:44:03 potential for something really 00:48:44:04 00:48:45:10 special that, you know, 00:48:46:02 00:48:47:21 so when you combine the fact that 00:48:47:22 00:48:48:25 you're taking something that ought 00:48:48:26 00:48:50:09 to be private and you're making it 00:48:50:10 00:48:51:24 public and 00:48:52:21 00:48:53:25 you're working with something that 00:48:54:00 00:48:55:07 everybody can identify with, 00:48:55:23 00:48:57:13 everyone was close by. 00:48:57:14 00:48:58:14 Everybody wears fabric. 00:48:58:19 00:49:00:20 It's our second skin, our second 00:49:00:21 00:49:01:20 home. 00:49:02:14 00:49:03:15 When you can make it something 00:49:03:16 00:49:04:23 tangible that people can connect 00:49:04:24 00:49:05:23 with sometimes 00:49:07:12 00:49:09:08 I think something can unlock or 00:49:09:09 00:49:10:22 shifted, the needle can move a 00:49:10:23 00:49:12:18 little bit, and so at a 00:49:12:19 00:49:13:18 time when 00:49:15:01 00:49:16:22 we are having trouble 00:49:16:23 00:49:18:06 communicating, and by " ; we" ; I mean 00:49:18:07 00:49:19:05 Americans, are having trouble 00:49:19:06 00:49:20:15 communicating with one another. 00:49:22:05 00:49:24:11 There has to be some room 00:49:24:12 00:49:26:14 in quilting for 00:49:26:22 00:49:27:22 us to have 00:49:28:19 00:49:29:21 something deeper than a 00:49:29:22 00:49:31:06 conversation, like something 00:49:31:20 00:49:32:23 that helps us reconnect 00:49:34:03 00:49:36:06 with what truly are our core 00:49:36:07 00:49:37:16 values as Americans. 00:49:38:20 00:49:40:07 I believe that almost all of us 00:49:40:08 00:49:42:05 would think that goodness 00:49:42:06 00:49:43:07 is an American value. 00:49:44:16 00:49:45:16 Compromise. 00:49:46:01 00:49:47:21 has been a long American value. 00:49:51:05 00:49:52:13 Consensus-building, working 00:49:52:23 00:49:54:16 together, getting the job done. 00:49:54:20 00:49:55:21 I mean, these are things that we 00:49:55:22 00:49:56:23 could really agree on. 00:49:57:16 00:49:58:23 So the thing that happens, 00:49:59:12 00:50:01:08 though, is that we disagree on the 00:50:01:09 00:50:02:08 words to use. 00:50:02:17 00:50:04:08 Right. So maybe we take words out of 00:50:04:09 00:50:05:15 the equation. We just pick up some 00:50:05:16 00:50:06:16 fabric and needle and thread 00:50:06:17 00:50:07:23 instead. And let's see what happens 00:50:07:24 00:50:08:23 if we work together on that. 00:50:09:02 00:50:10:04 I don't know what that looks like. 00:50:10:09 00:50:11:08 It's been something I've been puzzling 00:50:11:09 00:50:13:05 on, but I 00:50:13:06 00:50:14:20 think there's space in the United 00:50:14:24 00:50:16:15 States right now for some really 00:50:16:16 00:50:17:20 powerful quilting projects that. 00:50:19:23 00:50:20:23 Well, that is... 00:50:21:01 00:50:22:08 I can't wait to see them. 00:50:22:09 00:50:24:06 I really hope that those will 00:50:24:15 00:50:25:16 come out of this moment. 00:50:25:17 00:50:26:16 So it has been really 00:50:27:21 00:50:29:01 a delight to talk to you. 00:50:29:09 00:50:31:03 Is there anything you want to add or 00:50:31:04 00:50:32:10 that you didn't didn't feel like you 00:50:32:11 00:50:33:12 got to share or 00:50:34:23 00:50:35:23 anything else? 00:50:37:18 00:50:39:14 No, I want to say thank you for this 00:50:39:15 00:50:40:18 opportunity to talk. 00:50:40:19 00:50:42:13 Thank you. It's always nice to talk 00:50:42:14 00:50:43:20 to a like-minded soul, and 00:50:44:16 00:50:45:19 I want to thank folks for listening 00:50:45:20 00:50:46:22 to this whole thing, 00:50:48:08 00:50:49:08 I. 00:50:50:02 00:50:51:24 I got a lot of questions, you 00:50:52:00 00:50:53:22 know, about how 00:50:54:05 00:50:55:04 how life works. 00:50:55:05 00:50:56:23 So if anything that folks have heard 00:50:57:00 00:50:58:12 today in our conversation, it 00:50:58:13 00:50:59:15 sparked an idea, I would love to 00:50:59:16 00:51:00:19 hear from people. So maybe we can 00:51:00:20 00:51:02:11 figure out a way to connect somehow. 00:51:02:17 00:51:03:17 Absolutely. 00:51:04:11 00:51:05:19 Because I do think that when we all 00:51:05:20 00:51:07:06 put our heads together, we can see 00:51:07:07 00:51:08:14 things a little more clearly, you 00:51:08:15 00:51:09:15 know? 00:51:11:17 00:51:12:12 No, I appreciate it, I'm very 00:51:12:13 00:51:13:12 thankful for this time. 00:51:13:16 00:51:15:02 Yeah, well, thank you, I am 00:51:15:24 00:51:17:12 I'm supposed to say that we have 00:51:17:13 00:51:19:01 concluded our interview at three 00:51:19:04 00:51:20:01 fifty two p.m. 00:51:20:02 00:51:21:01 I didn't actually say when we 00:51:21:02 00:51:22:19 started it, so that's it's not that 00:51:22:23 00:51:23:23 helpful. 00:51:24:07 00:51:26:05 But yeah, that is, that was really 00:51:26:06 00:51:27:15 fantastic. Thank you so much. < ; end subtitles> ; 2021 Quilt Alliance. 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“Zak Foster,” Quilters' S.O.S. -- Save Our Stories, accessed October 17, 2026, https://qsos.quiltalliance.org/items/show/2567.